From gould!andrew.cmu.edu!nh0n+ Fri Jul 27 17:22:54 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA10745; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:22:53 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA16291; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:34:09 EDT Received: from ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA06121; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:33:09 -0400 Received: by andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:33:07 EDT Received: via switchmail; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:33:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix7.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:31:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix7.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:31:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from VUI.Andrew.3.20.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.unix7.andrew.cmu.edu.vax.3 via MS.5.6.unix7.andrew.cmu.edu.vax_3; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:31:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Date: Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:31:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Neil Anthony Herzinger To: Don Law Subject: Re: Roland Sampler mailing list Status: RO Hi, welcome to the sgroup! This group is for owners/users of Roland sampling gear (S10 50 550 330 770 and the W30). It is an interactive mailing list, meaning that all messages sent to the list are automatically bounced to all members. Discussion is open for anything you people would like to talk about. I try to locate and review third party manufacturers and encourage others to as well. Several members have successfully traded their own sounds with one another. Please send all messages to: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Subscription info to: nh0n+@andrew.cmu.edu neil herzinger Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA From gould!po2.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Mon Jul 30 23:41:56 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA08983; Mon, 30 Jul 90 23:41:54 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA25931; Mon, 30 Jul 90 23:52:44 EDT Received: from PO2.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA17199; Mon, 30 Jul 90 23:52:27 -0400 Received: by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Mon, 30 Jul 90 23:51:37 EDT Received: via switchmail; Mon, 30 Jul 90 23:51:31 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix7.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 30 Jul 90 23:49:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix7.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 30 Jul 90 23:49:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from VUI.Andrew.3.20.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.unix7.andrew.cmu.edu.vax.3 via MS.5.6.unix7.andrew.cmu.edu.vax_3; Mon, 30 Jul 90 23:49:45 -0400 (EDT) Resent-Message-Id: Resent-Date: Mon, 30 Jul 90 23:49:45 -0400 (EDT) Resent-From: Neil Anthony Herzinger Resent-To: Sgroup Return-Path: Date: Fri, 27 Jul 90 21:10:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Mailer-daemon Subject: Returned mail: Syntax error in distribution list contents To: andrew.cmu.edu!nh0n+ Message-Id: Status: RO The following message from ``nh0n+@andrew.cmu.edu'' could not be delivered to ``sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu'' because: The destination addresses of distribution list ``sgroup+'' are syntactically invalid and cannot be interpreted. The undelivered message follows: ---------------- Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 27 Jul 90 21:10:03 -0400 (EDT) Received: from apple.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Fri, 27 Jul 90 21:08:38 EDT Received: by apple.com (5.61/25-eef) id AA03902; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:47:23 -0700 for Received: by netcom.uucp (/\=-/\ Smail3.1.18.1 #18.40) id ; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:41 PDT Message-Id: From: netcom!sjs@apple.com (Stephen Schow) Subject: Sequencer Disks To: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Date: Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:41:21 PDT X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL5] Hey all, I am new to this group, so I would just like to introduce myself. My name is Steve Schow I am a Programmer/Semi-professional musician/Student I own the following equipment: Roland S-550 Roland MKS-20 Korg M1 Korg DW-8000 Art Multiverb BOSS GL-100 Barbetta Amp Mixers and things Macintosh & Vision I live in Redwood City, CA My musical ambition is to score movie soundtracks....I'm sure there are few of you with similar desires. Right now I just play and play and write and compose. I may work into the jingles market as a step in the right direction. I use the S-550 sampler all the time. The biggest problem that I have with it is setting up custom sequencer disks(i.e. Drums, Bass, etc...) Lately I haven't really been worrying about it toom much because I got the M1, however, I would really like to get the full potential out of my S-550 and free up the M1 for just sparkling killer synth sounds. I just keep reusing the same old sequence disks, which works OK, but my songs are starting to sound the same. Is there an easier way to do this? Is there any Mac software that does it for me? I already have the hard drive system disk which does do some automatic patch arrangement, but its not smart enough to tell when a patch is not in duall mode and so it sometimes uses up more memory than it should and therefore fills up quicker. Also, some of the better custom disks that I have purchased are smarter about truncating samples and squeezing stuff into the available memory. Again, is there any Mac software that does this sort of thing? I don't really care too much about actually editing sounds or sampling my own stuff(no flames please) ....I just don't have time to do that, especially with so many great sounds already available. Better yet, is there any sound trading going on with this group? I look forward to hearing what other netters are doing with their samplers. ---------------- From gould!andrew.cmu.edu!nh0n+ Fri Jul 27 17:22:54 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA10745; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:22:53 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA16291; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:34:09 EDT Received: from ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA06121; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:33:09 -0400 Received: by andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:33:07 EDT Received: via switchmail; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:33:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix7.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:31:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix7.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:31:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from VUI.Andrew.3.20.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.unix7.andrew.cmu.edu.vax.3 via MS.5.6.unix7.andrew.cmu.edu.vax_3; Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:31:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Date: Fri, 27 Jul 90 17:31:01 -0400 (EDT) From: Neil Anthony Herzinger To: Don Law Subject: Re: Roland Sampler mailing list Status: RO Hi, welcome to the sgroup! This group is for owners/users of Roland sampling gear (S10 50 550 330 770 and the W30). It is an interactive mailing list, meaning that all messages sent to the list are automatically bounced to all members. Discussion is open for anything you people would like to talk about. I try to locate and review third party manufacturers and encourage others to as well. Several members have successfully traded their own sounds with one another. Please send all messages to: sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Subscription info to: nh0n+@andrew.cmu.edu neil herzinger Carnegie Mellon University Pittsburgh, PA From gould!andrew.cmu.edu!nh0n+ Tue Jul 31 09:33:32 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA15821; Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:33:30 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA17621; Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:44:25 EDT Received: from ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA26541; Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:44:04 -0400 Received: by andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:43:06 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:43:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:41:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from encore.encore.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:39:15 EDT Received: by encore.encore.com (5.64/25-eef) id AA26311; Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:38:44 -0400 Date: Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:38:44 -0400 From: Don Law Message-Id: <9007311338.AA26311@encore.encore.com> To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: Hello, my name is ... Status: RO Hello, everyone. I'm one of the new guys in the group that Neil was talking about. I thought I would introduce myself. First of all, a special thanks to Neil for administering this thing! Here is a summary of what I have and what I do: NAME: Don Law HOME ADDRESS: 722 SW 81st Avenue #10A / North Lauderdale, FL 33068 WORK: Encore Computer Corporation / Fort Lauderdale, FL 33313 HOME PHONE: (305) 722-4016 WORK PHONE: (305) 587-2900 EQUIPMENT OWNED: SYNTHS: Roland- S-10 Sampler Yamaha- FB-01 Sound generator (4 op FM 8 voice multi) Yamaha- RX-15 Drum Machine Yamaha- CS60 - ANALOG! KNOBS! Maybe for sale. Kawai- MS710 - baby keys, lounge-lizard, but nice MIDI OTHER MIDI: Yamaha- YME8 2x8 Midi Splitter MusicQuest - PC Midi Card (MPU401 compatible) COMPUTER: IBM/XT Clone SEQUENCER: Voyetra Sequencer Plus Mark II INSTRUMENTS: Carvin LB70 Bass Guitar AMP: Plush P1000S Tube Amp w/ 2x15 speaker cabinet EFFECTS: DOD FX80B Compressor/Sustainer OTHER: Tektronix 454 Dual Trace Oscilloscope ACCESS TO: Yamaha- PSR-70 Casio- CZ-1 STYLE: Christian contemporary, pop. INFLUENCES: Everybody I listen to. REAL JOB: Development of parallel real-time Ada runtime systems. EMAIL: Internet: dlaw@encore.com Usenet: ...!uunet!gould!dlaw CURRENT MUSICAL ACTIVITIES: I play bass in "Crossover," a Christian (very non-profit) band. We have: me on bass, drums, guitar, vocal singer, and my XT on keys. We just had our first mini-concert in our local church sanctuary - it was great! Big room with nice acoustics. My first question for the Roland sample user's group: Does anyone know of a good source for those 2.8 inch "Quick disks" that the S-10 uses? I can buy them locally for $3 each. --Don From gould!andrew.cmu.edu!nh0n+ Tue Jul 31 10:09:19 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA15989; Tue, 31 Jul 90 10:09:18 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA18794; Tue, 31 Jul 90 10:20:03 EDT Received: from ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA28649; Tue, 31 Jul 90 10:19:45 -0400 Received: by andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Tue, 31 Jul 90 10:18:45 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 31 Jul 90 10:18:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 31 Jul 90 10:17:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from uxa.cso.uiuc.edu by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Tue, 31 Jul 90 10:16:40 EDT Received: by uxa.cso.uiuc.edu id AA00786 (5.64+/IDA-1.3.3 for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu); Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:16:14 -0500 Date: Tue, 31 Jul 90 09:16:14 -0500 From: "Derek A. Taubert" Message-Id: <9007311416.AA00786@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu> To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: New to the group Status: RO Well, I suppose I'm the other one who is new to this group. Hello to all. I'm afraid that I'm not quite as interesting as the other guys, but I'm working on it. I'm a student (Electrical Engineering) at the University of Illinois and I'm in a band back in my hometown. I play keyboard and sing most of the vocals. My equipment list is small, I don't have a job here at school, and it's hard to buy electronics with air. I have a roland W-30 that I got a few months ago, and an Apple IIgs that I program on a regular basis. I have all the midi equipment needed to interface the two, but I have yet to splurge for the software. So I have a few questions: 1) Does anyone with a IIgs have the mastertracks program? How does it rate? 2) I'm looking for some heavy electronic lead synth samples... I'll explain. I have great strings and saxs and jet airplanes, but I'm looking for some sounds that I can load up and really jam with the band. 3) Scott Palmer alerted me to a rumor that a memory upgrade was being worked on for the W-30. Any news? I like the keyboard, but 512K just isn't enough. From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Tue Jul 31 12:40:09 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA16511; Tue, 31 Jul 90 12:40:07 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA22225; Tue, 31 Jul 90 12:51:03 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA07318; Tue, 31 Jul 90 12:50:50 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Tue, 31 Jul 90 12:49:13 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 31 Jul 90 12:48:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 31 Jul 90 12:44:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Received: from chip.cs.ucla.edu by andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Tue, 31 Jul 90 12:44:20 EDT Date: 31 Jul 90 09:45:56 From: Tom Johnson Subject: Hi all--This looks like it' To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Status: RO Hi all--This looks like it's gonna be fun... Ok, let me introduce myself. My name is Tom Johnson. I entered UCLA in the music department (woodwind performance), but chickened out and decided to enter a "real" major instead :-). So I switched to Micro/molecular biology, got my degree and now I work in the Hardware lab of the UCLA CS department doing mac programming and networking. Go figure. All the others gave a rundown of their equipment, so here goes: Selmer mark VI alto and soprano saxes Chapman Stick--my current love. One of these days I'll get one of the MIDI versions. Assorted guitars and basses -- Yamaha Prototype BB1200 bass, LesPaul, ovation acoustic etc... Keyboards: Yamaha KX-88 -- couldn't live without it. Roland MKS-20 -- Still the best piano around IMHO Yamaha TX-81Z -- it's OK. but I don't use it too often Oberheim OB-8 -- I wouldn't trade this for anything Drum Machine: Oberheim DX -- got a great deal on it and I like making my own chips. Sequencers: Yamaha QX-7 -- A gift. Not too useful except as a scratch pad. Mac SE/30 w/ Performer, though I may switch to Vision one of these days. Effects: Zoom 9002 -- for the Stick. Amazing sound in a tiny package. ART SGE multi effect -- just got it. So far, so good. Yamaha Rev-7 reverb -- usually used for the keys. Misc MIDI stuff -- homebuilt MIDI patch bays and switchers Influences: Kate Bush (Happy B-day Kate-a day late), Beatles, Rush, Pink Floyd, Emmett Chapman, King Crimson, Tuck Andress and just about anything else I happen to hear. I'm sure you noticed that there isn't a single Roland Sampler in there. Well, the reason I subscribed is so that I could get an idea of which to get. Right now I'm sort of waffleing between getting an S-50, an S-550 or a Korg T-3. I haven't decided if I want to do my own sampling (I have so little free time that, initially at least, I'd prefer to concentrate on making music, not doing my own sampling. I do like the clear sound of the T-3 and the effects, but I just haven't decided if I want to give up the flexibility of creating my own samples if I find the time. I can't decide between the S-50 and S-550 because I love the additional memory and outs of the S-550, but I'd love to have a sort of "all-in-one" keyuboard I could just lug around from place to place (carrying a KX-88 and a rack around is not much fun). I suppose my main first question is this: Are ther any upgrades out there (Roland or otherwise) that can bring the S-50 into line with the capabilities of the S-550? If not, maybe I'll try to find an old Oberheim XK and just lug that around with the S-550. What do you all think? Thankd for listening..... Tom tj@cs.ucla.edu From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Tue Aug 7 21:31:46 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA13478; Tue, 7 Aug 90 21:31:44 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA28538; Tue, 7 Aug 90 21:38:10 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA15120; Tue, 7 Aug 90 21:38:33 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Tue, 7 Aug 90 21:37:12 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 7 Aug 90 21:37:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 7 Aug 90 21:35:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Xerox.COM by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Tue, 7 Aug 90 21:33:51 EDT Received: from Salvador.ms by ArpaGateway.ms ; 07 AUG 90 18:27:32 PDT Sender: gould!xerox.com!"Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B" Date: 7 Aug 90 18:27:20 PDT (Tuesday) Subject: Re: New guitar samples From: gould!xerox.com!DTycholis.LAX1B To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ In-Reply-To: netcom!sjs%apple:COM:Xerox's message of 1-August-90 (Wednesday) 16:39:30 PDT Message-Id: <900807-182732-16368@Xerox> Status: RO RE: Guitar samples: Steve, Neil: Thanks for the ideas, especially Steve's about layering the guitar samples to get a huge grinding effect....I'll give it a try. Trying to recreate a guitar sound, even with my experience (20+ years), seems to be a bit tricky. My goal is to record a guitar sample so when you play it back you can get the "right effect" on a keyboard or sequencer. For example, I'm playing with that classic "muffled-power -fifth-chunka-chunka with occasional ringing octave harmonic" that's popular for the verses of metal-type tunes. The problem is that with a sample of a single stroke "chunk", quick repetition of note-ons kills the tail end of the sample too quickly to sound right; it needs some tight overlapping of several samples. A longer sample with multiple pick hits sounds very real, but the key-transposition speed change wrecks it, and anyway, you are stuck with whatever beats/min. that I played it at. Perhaps spreading multiple chunks on nearby half-step keys will allow for the required overlap? Losing some notes is OK for sequencing but how do you feel about this scheme for live performance? (anyway, metal guitarists only play chords in first position E-F-F#-G-A, right? 8-). Oh well, maybe just some straight power chords, initially... I'm interested in finding out if people want to chew up memory with 3-second chord decays. Any preference on the durations? RE: sending samples around.... Since more than one person is interested in my guitar samples, they shall be submitted to George (gfd%mtdca.att) for incorporation in the unofficial S-series SUG library. [ As I see it, George has sort of volunteered to be the Un-Official Sample Tweaker/Librarian and Sample Swap Meet Coordinator. Please correct me if necessary, George! ] George has generously offered that one can request samples from his library of Public Domain stuff by sending him some diskettes blank or otherwise; though he has promised to respond muy pronto and twofold, if the submitted disks are loaded up with interesting PD samples. (If you would like a copy of the posting describing his offer, I can forward it.) Regards, Don --------- DTycholis.lax1b@Xerox.com From gould!po2.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Wed Aug 8 15:25:04 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA18594; Wed, 8 Aug 90 15:25:03 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA08480; Wed, 8 Aug 90 15:31:25 EDT Received: from PO2.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA20157; Wed, 8 Aug 90 15:31:49 -0400 Received: by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id ; Wed, 8 Aug 90 14:43:36 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 8 Aug 90 14:43:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 8 Aug 90 14:41:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Received: from att-in.att.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id ; Wed, 8 Aug 90 13:45:50 EDT From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!arpa!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 8 Aug 1990 13:12 EDT Subject: S-library (repost) Status: RO S-groupies, I have already had a few responses from the first wave of interested parties. I thought I would repost the ground rules. Thus far, I have samples of the Kawai drum machine (R-100?), and the yamaha RX-5(?) submitted by group members. I am slowly adding Korg M3r synth and drums samples. I will be able to get my hands on an Alesis HR-16 and perhaps samples from the Roland R8. I may simply create library disks by instrument. I have about 25 snare sounds, 20 kicks, etc. I've sampled some percussive sounds from my Matrix 1000 and even stolen a few drum sounds from some CD's. (FBI please disregard this last statement). Anyway, nothing heinous here. I must admit that my initial performance has been abyssmally slow (my apologies to those parties involved). I am now in a better position to do this and would encourage more participation. As I get myself more organized, I will post a list of what is available. I just picked up a new DAT machine so I have a much better system to work with (now, if my mixer comes back from the shop, I'll really be in business!). So far, participants have courteously heeded my requests below. You have my undying appreciation. So, send in disks if you're interested and I will post a listing soon of what's available. Be good. George ======================Obtaining Samples from The S-Group===================== (revised 8/8/90) OK, here we go. Some very basic rules: 1. disks sent and received should not contain Roland library samples unless seriously (and usefully) deranged to the point of non-recognition. 2. Every disk you send should be FORMATTED (I have both S-50 and S-330/S-550) and labeled. Unformatted disks will likely be returned empty and unformatted. Make sure you make note what machine they are formatted for. 3. For every disk of sounds you send, you'll get the original back (tweaked if necessary and time permitting) plus 2 disks filled. That is, if you send me one sound disk and 2 additional empty FORMATTED disks, you get 3 full disks back. A note on what type of samples you would like would help me choose. Otherwise, I'll send out a "best of" series. Limit 10 disks total. 4. I had originally thought of limiting my activities to drum samples but I think I'll do whatever. Make a note that I'm not particularly interested in acoustic instrument samples (get a proteus) unless they are unusual or extremely good. 5. For the most part, I'm not going to spend a lot of time looping these samples because of the time involved. Nor will I do much vel-fades or splits or whatever. Expect tones, not patches. 6. Return addressed postage (you know, SASE) is mandatory. I need stamped addressed envelopes or I'll wait until you send them. Sorry, no exceptions. 7. For those of you who just want disks for nothing: if you send formatted disks, I'll send something back: WHEN TIME ALLOWS. It could be weeks, it could be months: no promises. Folks that send sounds: I'll do my best for a week turnaround. 8. Use your imagination. Nobody wants 20 samples from Star Trek no matter how cute they are. We're making music, not video games :-). 9. My Address: George Demarest 110 East Fairview Avenue South Plainfield, NJ 07080 (201) 957-6392 10. Sample everything! I especially like synth stuff, samples for House-type stuff, drum samples, noises. 11. Please, sample all sounds at 30K sampling rate. There really is a difference! 12. Samples must not be used to barter for Iraqi petroleum. You may fire when ready: but read the above again before you do. I intend to have fun with this, but with over 20 members, it could get hairy and I don't have time to waste. It's really an easy deal and could get each of us some good stuff. Get into it... George -------------------- end of forwarded message -------------------- From gould!po8.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Tue Aug 14 12:41:20 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA25777; Tue, 14 Aug 90 12:41:18 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA12448; Tue, 14 Aug 90 12:39:37 EDT Received: from PO8.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA15554; Tue, 14 Aug 90 12:40:29 -0400 Received: by po8.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Tue, 14 Aug 90 12:35:04 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 14 Aug 90 12:34:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 14 Aug 90 12:32:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from saqqara.cis.ohio-state.edu by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup; Tue, 14 Aug 90 12:30:54 EDT Received: by saqqara.cis.ohio-state.edu (5.61-kk/5.900605) id AA14099; Tue, 14 Aug 90 12:30:51 -0400 Received: by david.UUCP (smail3.0) id AA04925; 14 Aug 90 11:53:53 EDT (Tue) To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup Subject: Samples via e-mail. (R/W Roland disk on the Mac) Message-Id: <9008141153.AA04925@david.UUCP> Date: 14 Aug 90 11:53:53 EDT (Tue) From: gould!cis.ohio-state.edu!david!david (David A. Roth) Status: RO I still can't believe that no one has written a utility to run on the Mac to read/write data for the Roland Samplers. Just for the purpose of reading the data from a disk and uuencoding it so it would be uudecoded at the other end and written back to Roland format on the Mac. I don't have any compilers for my Mac. Anyone have any ideas? Disk utilities that they have used to examine the Roland disk format? Thanks in advance. David ------------------------------------------------------------------------ _TT /| |~ >====ttt===< | O| |~ att!osu-cis!david!david {_|||_} \| O| or n8emr!david!david David A. Roth uunet!abvax!osu-cis!david!david From CompuServ: send >internet:david@david.uucp ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gould!po8.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Tue Aug 14 18:47:46 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA29088; Tue, 14 Aug 90 18:47:44 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA21198; Tue, 14 Aug 90 18:48:47 EDT Received: from PO8.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA28300; Tue, 14 Aug 90 18:46:55 -0400 Received: by po8.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Tue, 14 Aug 90 18:37:49 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 14 Aug 90 18:37:38 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 14 Aug 90 18:34:57 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Xerox.COM by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup; Tue, 14 Aug 90 18:34:22 EDT Received: from Salvador.ms by ArpaGateway.ms ; 14 AUG 90 15:13:42 PDT Sender: gould!xerox.com!"Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B" Date: 14 Aug 90 15:08:28 PDT (Tuesday) Subject: Re: Samples via e-mail. (R/W Roland disk on the Mac) From: gould!xerox.com!DTycholis.LAX1B To: cis.ohio-state.edu!david!david Cc: xerox.com!DTycholis.LAX1B, andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup In-Reply-To: david!david%cis.ohio-state:EDU:Xerox's message of 14-August-90 (Tuesday) 12:31:21 PDT Message-Id: <900814-151342-3916@Xerox> Status: RO David, I agree; there is a real void of PD and low-buck utility Mac software for the Roland gear. For the last few years, I've been tinkering with a program to read Tones from my S-550 into the Mac via Midi Sysex, display it, edit it, and write it back. I've lost the motivation to finish it off, as I never seem to have enought time to do it all and still live the American dream.... 8-). Actually, designing a user interface for an S-550 librarian has been a bother; if I had a better idea of how I should go about managing the Tones, parameters, and memory in the S-550, I might get going again on it. Feel free to offer suggestions! However, your idea is different, and sounds very useful as it would eliminate the trouble and expense of shipping floppies around. It shouldn't be difficult at all if someone can tell me how to access the Mac disk drive at the hardware level (i.e. read (and write) all the data on a track, seek to the next track, do it again). I would have to be able to get at every bit on the track, as I'm sure the Roland disk format is incomptible with the Mac's. Mac copy-protection busting software (e.g. Copy II Mac) can probably do this; darn, they forgot to include *the Source* for my $39.99! Apple highly discourages this sort of non-portable low-level programming, so I doubt that "Inside Mac" will help here. Does anyone know how this can be done? Regards, Don ----------- Don Tycholis DTycholis.LAX1B@Xerox.Com "It has been my experience that folks who have no vices have very few virtues" -- Abraham Lincoln From gould!postmaster Wed Aug 15 10:20:39 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA00367; Wed, 15 Aug 90 10:20:38 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA04127; Wed, 15 Aug 90 10:33:53 EDT Received: from PO7.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA13958; Wed, 15 Aug 90 10:32:28 -0400 Received: by po7.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Wed, 15 Aug 90 10:31:09 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 15 Aug 90 10:31:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 15 Aug 90 10:29:59 -0400 (EDT) Received: from encore.encore.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Wed, 15 Aug 90 10:29:20 EDT Received: by encore.encore.com (5.64/25-eef) id AA13784; Wed, 15 Aug 90 10:29:00 -0400 Date: Wed, 15 Aug 90 10:29:00 -0400 From: Don Law Message-Id: <9008151429.AA13784@encore.encore.com> To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: Re: Samples via e-mail. (R/W Roland disk on the Mac) Status: RO Don Tycholis writes: > It shouldn't be difficult at all if someone can tell me how > to access the Mac disk drive at the hardware level ... Well, I don't use a Mac, but here is my idea of how to get samples from the Roland onto the net (say for anonymous FTP): Dump the sample into a track on the sequencer with nothing else in the track. Save this track in MIDI standard format. [Optional step which applies for me - I work much better on my Unix machine than on the XT that runs the sequencer: Copy the file containing the dump to a computer on the internet.] Run a program that translates the MIDI track containing the sample (in a sysex, I assume) to some format suitable for distribution. This last step may not be necesary in some cases. I haven't actually tried this, but I plan to, including writing the translation program on a Unix system. This will eliminate the need to mess with reading a sample disk on a Mac disk drive. Comments? --Don Law dlaw@encore.com ...!uunet!gould!dlaw --Ada Development, MS404 --Encore Computer Corporation ***** In the computer lab, ***** --Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33313 ***** No one can hear you scream. ***** From gould!RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM!ESC Wed Aug 15 11:35:44 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA00703; Wed, 15 Aug 90 11:35:42 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA05917; Wed, 15 Aug 90 11:37:34 EDT Received: from RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA16362; Wed, 15 Aug 90 11:36:06 -0400 Received: from DJINN.SCRC.Symbolics.COM by RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM via CHAOS with CHAOS-MAIL id 488157; 15 Aug 90 11:03:05 EDT Date: Wed, 15 Aug 90 11:04 EDT From: Eric S. Crawley Subject: Re: Samples via e-mail. (R/W Roland disk on the Mac) To: Don Law Cc: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ In-Reply-To: <9008151429.AA13784@encore.encore.com> Message-Id: <19900815150443.3.ESC@DJINN.SCRC.Symbolics.COM> Status: RO There are a few problems with the idea of recording samples as sequences and then sending the sequences around. The first is that there is no way to send sysex dumps from the panels of Roland Samplers. The only way to do sysex dumps in either direction is under program control. If someone wants to make some sequences that send the proper sysex bytes to send and receive the samples, then we might be able to do something. I don't recall the level of handshaking that is necessary to do this on Roland samplers. The next problem is that many sequencers cannot handle the volume of sysex data that would be involved and we could have problems with checksums failing. The proposal I made was to use some standard sample file format, say SoundDesigner and send these files around. The problem is that you can only send around Tones, in RolandSpeak, and you miss out on all the neat patch data. It would also require some sample editing software for all the users, unless someone wanted to hack together the code to do the job. I'm afraid we are stuck schelpping around disks until some of these problems can be solved. From gould!po7.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Wed Aug 15 13:40:54 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA01524; Wed, 15 Aug 90 13:40:52 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA08845; Wed, 15 Aug 90 13:42:47 EDT Received: from PO7.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA21598; Wed, 15 Aug 90 13:41:13 -0400 Received: by po7.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Wed, 15 Aug 90 13:34:35 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 15 Aug 90 13:34:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 15 Aug 90 13:30:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id ; Wed, 15 Aug 90 13:01:43 EDT Received: from DJINN.SCRC.Symbolics.COM by RIVERSIDE.SCRC.Symbolics.COM via CHAOS with CHAOS-MAIL id 488157; 15 Aug 90 11:03:05 EDT Date: Wed, 15 Aug 90 11:04 EDT From: Eric S. Crawley Subject: Re: Samples via e-mail. (R/W Roland disk on the Mac) To: Don Law Cc: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ In-Reply-To: <9008151429.AA13784@encore.encore.com> Message-Id: <19900815150443.3.ESC@DJINN.SCRC.Symbolics.COM> Status: RO There are a few problems with the idea of recording samples as sequences and then sending the sequences around. The first is that there is no way to send sysex dumps from the panels of Roland Samplers. The only way to do sysex dumps in either direction is under program control. If someone wants to make some sequences that send the proper sysex bytes to send and receive the samples, then we might be able to do something. I don't recall the level of handshaking that is necessary to do this on Roland samplers. The next problem is that many sequencers cannot handle the volume of sysex data that would be involved and we could have problems with checksums failing. The proposal I made was to use some standard sample file format, say SoundDesigner and send these files around. The problem is that you can only send around Tones, in RolandSpeak, and you miss out on all the neat patch data. It would also require some sample editing software for all the users, unless someone wanted to hack together the code to do the job. I'm afraid we are stuck schelpping around disks until some of these problems can be solved. From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Fri Aug 17 20:37:32 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA14837; Fri, 17 Aug 90 20:37:31 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA14260; Fri, 17 Aug 90 20:39:22 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA13708; Fri, 17 Aug 90 20:38:15 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Fri, 17 Aug 90 20:37:08 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Fri, 17 Aug 90 20:37:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 17 Aug 90 20:35:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Xerox.COM by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Fri, 17 Aug 90 20:34:33 EDT Received: from Salvador.ms by ArpaGateway.ms ; 17 AUG 90 17:29:44 PDT Sender: gould!xerox.com!"Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B" Date: 17 Aug 90 17:29:30 PDT (Friday) Subject: Re: Looping the loop From: gould!xerox.com!"Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B" To: mtdca.att.com!gfd Cc: xerox.com!DTycholis.LAX1B, andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ In-Reply-To: gfd%mtdca.att:COM:Xerox's message of 14-August-90 (Tuesday) 12:06:41 PDT Message-Id: <900817-172944-9343@Xerox> Status: RO I vaguely remember reading several articles on looping in the back issues of Music Technology Magazine (now defunct and folded into Home Studio & Recording), Electronic Musician, and Keyboard. Many of these articles are now several years old (how time flies!), but the concepts apply as much today as they did on the Emulator II and Akai S900 (watchit, starting to sound like an old-timer all ready 8-). As I recall, there were lots of helpful hints; however, there is no particularly earth-shattering secret to getting "the perfect loop", except the authors of these articles generally seemed to think that cross-fading would often save a hopeless loop, and Sound Designer made the process easier. Summary: Cross-fading is supposed to even out the differences in amplitude and frequency content at the beginning and end points of the sample loop. Cross-fading is not an instant cure; you must mess around with different combinations of amplitude adjustments and various start/end points. And just because the sampler software can't find the perfect loop, don't give up, it might be there, just start getting serious about trying various techniques. ------------ Well, time for a "sidebar (mag talk)" on crossfades: I've never tried cross-fading since I don't have Alchemy or Sound Designer for my Mac. Here's how cross-fading *might* be done ( and perhaps someone can set me straight on how it really works ) ... 1.) copy the "tail" of a sample to another memory slot, e.g., I 21. Most likely this piece exhibits decreasing amplitude ( > ). 2.) copy the tail to another memory slot, e.g. I 22 . 3.) reverse I 22, so this piece exhibits increasing amplitude ( < ). 4.) mix I 22 with I 21, resulting in a somewhat "hourglass shaped" piece ( >< ) 5.) compress the piece so that the amplitude at all points is as large as the initial starting point, thus filling in the hourglass into a solid "log". (here I go into my overly technical talk again 8-). 6.) either mix the log piece with the original tail, at the original copy start point, or cut the orignal tail out and paste the new piece in. (Note: the built-in S-550 editor doesn't compress - I think it does reverse though - so I've never tried the above steps; amplitude smoothing is definitely required to make this work. There is a "smoothing" function built-in to the S-550, but I've only tried that a few times in a hurry, didn't like it, and so don't know what good it does.) If this is how cross-fading works, you might be able to play around with the "copy, tweak, and mix back in" notion, even if your sampler software *does* have cross-fade, as this approach might give you more control over what happens. ------------ In sampling, it seems to help if you run the input signal through a compressor to smooth out the amplitude variations at the tail of the sample, which seem to cause more annoying "clicks" than frequency variations. Perhaps you could also smooth frequency variations post-process by using the digital filtering features of the built-in sample editor. I just avoid looping, in general 8-). If looping is required, my approach is to try everything and listen to the result. This is easiest on the sampler where you can listen as you move the start/end points. Can't imagine doing in on a Mac Plus where you cannot hear the result of a change. There is a card (Digidesign?) for the Mac II family where you can hear the results of a sample tweak, but I don't think it is as "interactive" as the S-550 software. Regards, Don PS - my apologies for being S-550-centric but I'm not familiar with the differences between the various models of the S-series. Also sorry for over-hyphenating 8-). From gould!po2.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Mon Aug 20 10:13:50 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA01019; Mon, 20 Aug 90 10:13:48 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA10685; Mon, 20 Aug 90 10:14:36 EDT Received: from PO2.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA05902; Mon, 20 Aug 90 10:13:35 -0400 Received: by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Mon, 20 Aug 90 10:10:37 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Mon, 20 Aug 90 10:10:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 20 Aug 90 10:08:55 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Received: from att-in.att.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Mon, 20 Aug 90 10:08:41 EDT From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!arpa!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 20 Aug 1990 9:20 EDT Subject: Loops, Basses and Coding Status: RO > George, speaking of bass samples.... Yes, send them along. > Also, as a project for my brother-in-law, I sampled several verses of M.C. > Hammer's "You Can't Touch Dis" CD and used the samples to create a 45 > < the Performer file which sequences the song?>> Why not?! If nothing else it'd be good for a laugh. > By the way, the stuff you sent me was great. I especially loved the > "stereo" Korg piano! I'm looking forward to the Alesis 16-B samples when > available. Maybe I was unclear. I'm getting HR-16, not 16B samples :-(. I'm going to work on the 16B as well but I don't have access to one yet. I'm getting to know one of the salesmen at Sam Ash pretty well and he's promised to get some R-8 samples in exchange for stuff from this group. He's especially into good cymbal sounds for some jazz. Anyone got anything good? Also, I just did some sampling of Korg M3r drum sounds that came out great. Some great gated sounds. Some are very 16B-ish. Mostly hot synthy sounds. Not much one realism but lot's of punch. More on the way. Great posting on crossfades, by the way. Incidentally, I have the Digidesign Sound Tools with Sound Designer 2. I never thought of that approach to looping. Great ideas. You must know by now that mostly I do close loops (ie one period of a complex wave) and then cheat and detune and LFO the shit of the samples:-). I'll fire up Sound Designer this week and try the method you describe. Also, I was leaning towards Think C for programming the Mac. I would like tools to create dialog boxes, etc so that also pointed me towards MacApp. ************ * NOTE: ************ I'm going to rearrange the organization of the drum sample library. Right now I have about 30 snares, 20 Kicks, 25 toms, 15 cymbals, and a whole-bunch-o' percussion (electronic and otherwise). What I plan to do is group all similar instruments on a single disk. So far, I've made a snare and a kick disk. I'll do the others by this week. As I finish, those wanting drum sounds should take this into account. If you want the full library, it'll probably be 6 or 7 disks. I'll let you know when I'm done. > Thanks much, > Don Peace george george From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Wed Aug 22 15:30:22 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA03349; Wed, 22 Aug 90 15:30:20 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA17849; Wed, 22 Aug 90 15:28:59 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA10622; Wed, 22 Aug 90 15:28:15 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Wed, 22 Aug 90 15:27:04 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 22 Aug 90 15:27:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 22 Aug 90 15:25:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Xerox.COM by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Wed, 22 Aug 90 15:23:12 EDT Received: from Salvador.ms by ArpaGateway.ms ; 22 AUG 90 12:02:17 PDT Sender: gould!xerox.com!"Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B" Date: 22 Aug 90 11:57:25 PDT (Wednesday) Subject: ToneGenics Has Custom Mods for Roland S-50 Sampler From: gould!xerox.com!DTycholis.LAX1B To: ads.com!pdel Cc: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+, xerox.com!DTycholis.LAX1B, xerox.com!Synth.AllAreas, eddie.mit.edu!Rec-Music-Synth Message-Id: <900822-120217-1834@Xerox> Status: RO Thought y'all would be interested in knowing about this company, which sent me some information yesterday: Company: ToneGenics Corporation P.O. Box 8288 Van Nuys, Ca. 91409 Phone: (818) 786-1177 Products: S-50 +8 Output Mod & Updated S/W --> $350 S-50 SCSI Hard Disk Interface Mod --> $500 JC-120 Killer Distortion Mod --> $300 GM-70 (MIDI Guitar) All B-String Mod --> $150 GR-700 (Guitar Synth) MIDI In Mod --> $200 MT-32 Memory Backup Mod --> $95 D-50 Memory Expansion Mod --> $350 to 750 Of special interest to the S-Series Sampler distribution group are the S-50 mods. You can order the information by calling their number and leaving a message with your name and address. It took them about a week and a half to get it to me. Cheers, Don Disclaimer: I have absolutely no relationship with ToneGenics. I've never been a customer and probably will have no reason to be one, unless I inherit some of the above gear from my relatives. The S-Series Sampler support person at Roland referred me to them (when I queried the existence of PBC Technical Services, which he has never heard of), and I am merely sharing the information I recieved. -------- Don Tycholis DTycholis.LAX1B@Xerox.Com From gould!hplb.hpl.hp.com!mjp Fri Aug 24 04:51:07 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA00656; Fri, 24 Aug 90 04:51:06 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA15309; Fri, 24 Aug 90 04:49:53 EDT Received: from hplb.hpl.hp.com by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA19277; Fri, 24 Aug 90 04:49:16 -0400 Received: from prudence.hpl.hp.com by hplb.hpl.hp.com; Fri, 24 Aug 90 09:46:00 +0100 Received: from localhost by prudence.hpl.hp.com with SMTP (15.11/15.6+ISC) id AA05749; Fri, 24 Aug 90 09:47:10 bst Message-Id: <9008240847.AA05749@prudence.hpl.hp.com> To: Don Law Subject: Re: Help : PC Sequencing In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 18 Jun 90 13:37:12 EDT." <9006181737.AA11889@encore.encore.com> Date: Fri, 24 Aug 90 09:47:09 BST From: Mike Prudence Status: RO Don, Hi there ! I've been running through my mailbox following up some older messages, and guess what - it's your turn !! I've now been working pretty solidly with the Voyetra sequencer for a few months now, and been getting some halfway decent results with it. One thought that comes to mind is whether you'd be interested in receiving a sequence file - in the interests of transatlantic communication. I haven't been able to track down any other Voyetra users - the tide is against the program because it is copy protected, by the looks of it. I wrote a particularyly nasty latter to Voyetra informing them of my views on the matter, and those of quite a few other people, so maybe they will change their policy. Anyway, how is it going with your attempts to get CZ-1 patches from ucsd.edu down through the sequencer into your CZ-1 ?? Did you figure out the format ? Cheers, Yours curiously, Mike. From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Sat Aug 25 04:51:21 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA05100; Sat, 25 Aug 90 04:51:20 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA22372; Sat, 25 Aug 90 04:50:15 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA24363; Sat, 25 Aug 90 04:49:42 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Sat, 25 Aug 90 04:49:06 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Sat, 25 Aug 90 04:49:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 25 Aug 90 04:47:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hub.ucsb.edu by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Sat, 25 Aug 90 04:47:22 EDT Received: from ivucsb.UUCP by hub.ucsb.edu; id AA10587 sendmail 4.0/UCSB-2.0-sun via UUCP Sat, 25 Aug 90 01:45:53 PDT for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Received: by ivucsb.sba.ca.us (smail2.5) id AA00291; 25 Aug 90 01:41:08 PDT (Sat) Subject: Disk sucker for s50 To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ (Roland Support Group) Date: Sat, 25 Aug 90 1:41:05 PDT Organization: QuickSilver Rallye Team, Santa Barbara, CA X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL4] Message-Id: <9008250141.AA00291@ivucsb.sba.ca.us> From: gould!ivucsb.sba.ca.us!todd (Todd Day) Status: RO I've written a quick and dirty program for my UNIXPC that reads all the data off an s50 disk. Luckily for me, the s50, the s550, the IBMPC, and the UNIXPC all use the same floppy disk controller. Note that I haven't refined the program to get at individual songs. Also note that the program will be easily transferable to the s550 and the IBMPC when done (will probably also run on the Amiga and Atari, but not Mac, as the Mac has strange drives). This is a totally blind hack. If someone has info on how the data is stored on the disk, things would go much, much faster... -- Todd Day | todd@ivucsb.sba.ca.us | ucsbcsl!ivucsb!todd "I believed what I was told, I thought it was a good life, I thought I was happy. Then I found something that changed it all..." --- Anonymous, 2112 From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Sun Aug 26 22:53:17 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA09756; Sun, 26 Aug 90 22:53:15 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA13795; Sun, 26 Aug 90 22:51:49 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA06828; Sun, 26 Aug 90 22:51:52 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Sun, 26 Aug 90 22:51:06 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Sun, 26 Aug 90 22:51:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sun, 26 Aug 90 22:50:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hub.ucsb.edu by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Sun, 26 Aug 90 22:49:43 EDT Received: from ivucsb.UUCP by hub.ucsb.edu; id AA02575 sendmail 4.0/UCSB-2.0-sun via UUCP Sun, 26 Aug 90 19:48:11 PDT for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Received: by ivucsb.sba.ca.us (smail2.5) id AA05318; 26 Aug 90 19:39:33 PDT (Sun) Subject: S50 disks + theory + lotsa fun stuff in the schematics To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ (Roland Support Group) Date: Sun, 26 Aug 90 19:39:30 PDT In-Reply-To: <0aq4RzW00WB885LlAw@andrew.cmu.edu>; from "Neil Anthony Herzinger" at Aug 26, 90 6:04 pm Organization: QuickSilver Rallye Team, Santa Barbara, CA X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL4] Message-Id: <9008261939.AA05318@ivucsb.sba.ca.us> From: gould!ivucsb.sba.ca.us!todd (Todd Day) Status: RO %Terrific work! It sounds like you've been pretty dedicated to working up the %program, it sounds great. The S50 format is fine with me (since I own one), %but keep in mind there is a program that can copy sounds from the S550 into %sounds for the S50. I have it if anyone is interested in a copy. Yeah, I have that too. Got it from the dealer. I'm going to ramble a bit here and explain how the disk stuff works on an S50. Since the wave data is 12bits internally, the S50 must convert eight bit disk data to the twelve bit format. It reads in data off the disk three bytes at a time. Here is some sample data in hex format. Byte 1 Byte 2 Byte 3 ------ ------ ------ $AB $CD $EF To convert to twelve bits, it does this. Word 1 Word 2 ------ ------ $ABC $EFD Strange, eh? Here are some memory calculations... 512 bytes/sector * 36 sectors/sound_bank * 2 words/3 bytes = 12288 words/sound_bank (12288 words/sound_bank) / (30 kwords/sec sampling) = 0.4096 secs/sound_bank So this is where they get the 0.4 second increments for sampling. Let's see, there are two big banks of sounds (A & B) consisting of 7.2 secs of sound each (at 30kHz). So, we have 14.4 total_secs / (0.4 secs/bank) = 36 sound_banks 36 sound_banks * 12288 words/sound_bank = 442368 words of sampling memory But, the schematics say we have two banks of 512*512 words, or 524288. So, we have been cheated out of 81920 words. At 30kHz, this is 2.73 seconds! There is no excuse for losing those 2.73 seconds of sampling time (although it does make getting data off of disk a lot easier). The wave gate array chip has access to its own SRAM, so it doesn't need to use this 12-bit memory for anything. An interesting project would be to add another half a meg of RAM to this beastie. It could be done because CAS2 and CAS3 are unused. I suppose those are used in the S550 to double the amount of sounds. However, I suppose the S50 software wouldn't even recognize the extra memory. Too bad. Hmmm... maybe the reason they can't get that extra 2.73 seconds is because they can't pack the data onto the disk. Let's see... Total space on a disk = 512 bytes/sector * 9 sectors/track * 80 tracks/head * 2 heads = 737280 bytes = 491520 12bit-words Waveform data starts at hex $12000, which is 73728 bytes. This just happens to take up the equivalent of 4 sound_banks. How many sound_banks on a disk? 737280 bytes/disk * (2 words/3 bytes) / (12288 words/sound_bank) = 40 sound_banks/disk Subtract the program and header info, and we have 36 sound_banks/disk. There you have it! We are missing out on 2.73 secs because they can't fit it on the disk. So, a question for you. How does the S550 end up storing twice as many sound banks as the S50? The must have some kind of weird compression. Either that, or they use high density floppies. But since the S50 can read S550 disks, that would imply that the S50 can read/write HD disks. So what gives? Hey, looking at the schematics, I see they have a drive select 1 on the bus! Anyone think it's possible to daisy chain another drive onto this sucker? Wow, that's quite a ways off the original topic... going back... %I have a Mac, so what damage does this 8 bit conversion thing do to the %samples? Total loss of dynamic range and high end. Sampling on Mac is done at 22 or 11 kHz. No problem converting to S50 at 30 kHz, just press a key lower in tone and the sound comes out at normal pitch. %Also, how are we going to get this program to users? Forgive me if %these are stupid questions, but I'm not the greatest hack. After I get it converted to the IBMPC, I'll release a compiled version and the source. I would appreciate it if the people using it would send me their changes so I can be a clearing house of the latest and greatest version. Now that I've hacked the way the S50 does things (totally without ANY outside info, no less! (brag, brag)), I'd like to keep standardized versions of any conversion programs. -- Todd Day | todd@ivucsb.sba.ca.us | ucsbcsl!ivucsb!todd "I believed what I was told, I thought it was a good life, I thought I was happy. Then I found something that changed it all..." --- Anonymous, 2112 From gould!po7.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Tue Aug 28 06:22:07 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA23313; Tue, 28 Aug 90 06:22:06 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA14912; Tue, 28 Aug 90 06:20:46 EDT Received: from PO7.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA14330; Tue, 28 Aug 90 06:20:53 -0400 Received: by po7.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Tue, 28 Aug 90 06:20:07 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 28 Aug 90 06:20:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 28 Aug 90 06:18:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ifi.uio.no by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Tue, 28 Aug 90 06:18:11 EDT Received: from mannen.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Tue, 28 Aug 1990 12:17:45 +0200 From: Thomas Flemming Received: by mannen.ifi.uio.no ; Tue, 28 Aug 1990 12:17:40 +0200 Date: Tue, 28 Aug 1990 12:17:40 +0200 Message-Id: <9008281017.AAmannen00329@mannen.ifi.uio.no> To: ivucsb.sba.ca.us!todd Cc: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ In-Reply-To: Todd Day's message of Sun, 26 Aug 90 0:32:55 PDT <9008260032.AA03552@ivucsb.sba.ca.us> Subject: Re: Mac to S-50 conversion Status: RO Nice nice TodDay! If you could mail the source-code for the 8bit to S-50 disk conversion program, then maybe I could convert it to Atari. The disk format is almost the same for the Atari as standard PC 3.5" 750K disks. Also if you are looking for 8bit sounds ,terminator.cc.umich.edu is loaded with megabytes of 8bit samples up to 40K-sampling rate. Try ftp from atari/sound/sounds/ or msdos/sound/. Thomas 'loopmaster' Flemminginginginging From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Tue Aug 28 13:13:18 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA24947; Tue, 28 Aug 90 13:13:17 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA27330; Tue, 28 Aug 90 13:11:58 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA29215; Tue, 28 Aug 90 13:11:32 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Tue, 28 Aug 90 13:03:15 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 28 Aug 90 13:02:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 28 Aug 90 12:58:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from encore.encore.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Tue, 28 Aug 90 12:57:30 EDT Received: by encore.encore.com (5.64/25-eef) id AA28405; Tue, 28 Aug 90 12:57:30 -0400 Date: Tue, 28 Aug 90 12:57:30 -0400 From: Don Law Message-Id: <9008281657.AA28405@encore.encore.com> To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: Re: Samples via e-mail. (R/W Roland disk on the Mac) Status: RO I haven't had much time to continue my S-10 => Voyetra/PC => Unix project, but I' throw out one piece of info that might help: Eric S. Crawley writes: > The first is that there is no way to send sysex dumps > from the panels of Roland Samplers. I don't think there is one docuemented, but on my S-10 there is a key combination that will do it. I think it is hold down "midi" and press "enter." FWIW (For What It's Worth). --Don Law dlaw@encore.com ...!uunet!gould!dlaw --Ada Development, MS404 --Encore Computer Corporation ***** In the computer lab, ***** --Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33313 ***** No one can hear you scream. ***** From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Tue Aug 28 14:22:18 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA25537; Tue, 28 Aug 90 14:22:16 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA28717; Tue, 28 Aug 90 14:20:55 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA05092; Tue, 28 Aug 90 14:21:01 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for henrik@eddie.mit.edu; Tue, 28 Aug 90 13:39:33 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 28 Aug 90 13:39:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 28 Aug 90 13:38:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from WLV.IMSD.CONTEL.COM by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Tue, 28 Aug 90 13:37:32 EDT Received: from WLBR.IMSD.CONTEL.COM by WLV.IMSD.CONTEL.COM (5.64/1.25) id AA24531; Tue, 28 Aug 90 10:37:21 -0700 Received: by WLBR.IMSD.CONTEL.COM (5.61++/1.25) id AA16499; Tue, 28 Aug 90 10:37:11 -0700 Date: Tue, 28 Aug 90 10:37:11 -0700 From: gould!wlv.imsd.contel.com!pete%WLBR (Pete Lyall) Message-Id: <9008281737.AA16499@WLBR.IMSD.CONTEL.COM> To: encore.com!dlaw, andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: Re: Samples via e-mail. (R/W Roland disk on the Mac) Status: RO I believe the combiniation is something like F1 + MIDI, and then you can scroll backwards and forwards through ONE WAY/HANDSHAKE SEND/RECEIVE options. If you have the manual, it's in fine print in the memory map stuff. Pete From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Thu Aug 30 11:49:42 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA04635; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:49:41 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA05892; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:48:02 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA18396; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:48:46 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:46:53 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:46:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:42:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ifi.uio.no by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:42:18 EDT Received: from kjalar.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Thu, 30 Aug 1990 17:42:07 +0200 From: Thomas Flemming Received: by kjalar.ifi.uio.no ; Thu, 30 Aug 1990 17:42:02 +0200 Date: Thu, 30 Aug 1990 17:42:02 +0200 Message-Id: <9008301542.AAkjalar10764@kjalar.ifi.uio.no> To: sgi.com!jeff%jeff.esd Cc: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ In-Reply-To: Jeff Mock's message of Wed, 29 Aug 90 14:08:47 PDT <9008292108.AA00406@jeff.esd.sgi.com> Subject: Re: ftp site for samples? Status: RO Welcome Jeff, until now we have only been exchanging samples by surface mail. But since it's possible to read and write S-50 disks on a normal IBM-PC with a 3.5"drive we'll hopefully be able to send some kind of standard files via email. This will also work for Amiga's and Atari's (with PC emulator). Also this is a much cleaner and faster way of transfering samples than by MIDI. I've also discovered that the S-50 and W-30 (and proabably also the S-330) stores the samples on exactly the same disk sectors, so it will practically be enough with just one program. Thomas Flemming From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Thu Aug 30 14:23:07 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA05206; Thu, 30 Aug 90 14:23:06 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA09380; Thu, 30 Aug 90 14:21:24 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA23158; Thu, 30 Aug 90 14:22:06 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Thu, 30 Aug 90 14:20:55 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Thu, 30 Aug 90 14:20:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 30 Aug 90 14:19:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from SGI.COM by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Thu, 30 Aug 90 14:19:11 EDT Received: from relay.sgi.com by SGI.COM via SMTP (5.64-bind 1.5+ida/900410.SGI) for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu id AA09846; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:18:54 -0700 Received: from gate-mars.sgi.com by relay.sgi.com (5.52/900423.SGI) for @sgi.sgi.com:gfd@mtdca.att.com id AA29082; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:18:46 PDT Received: from jeff.esd.sgi.com by mars.esd.sgi.com (5.52/900423.SGI) for @relay.sgi.com:sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu id AA18318; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:18:43 PDT Received: by jeff.esd.sgi.com (5.52/891101.SGI) for @mars.esd.sgi.com:gfd@mtdca.att.com id AA01076; Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:18:41 PDT Date: Thu, 30 Aug 90 11:18:41 PDT From: gould!sgi.com!jeff%jeff.esd.sgi.com (Jeff Mock) Message-Id: <9008301818.AA01076@jeff.esd.sgi.com> To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+, mtdca.att.com!gfd Subject: Re: ftp site for samples? Status: RO George and group, Roland, in their infinite wisdom, built the S-770 in such a way that it can read and convert S-550/W-30 sample disks, but it can't write them. The S-770 format is unique. So, I can go to the music store and copy the Roland catalog but I can't send you my collection of kitchen sounds. This is really anti-social on Roland's part. I have Alchemy on my Mac and I've nearly got a HyperMIDI stack to suck data out of the S-770, mostly so I can backup my sampler on tape. If someone figures out how to use a Mac to read and write Roland disks I'll be able to share data. Does anyone know how to solve this problem? jeff From gould!po2.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Thu Aug 30 15:35:03 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA05451; Thu, 30 Aug 90 15:35:02 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA11055; Thu, 30 Aug 90 15:33:20 EDT Received: from PO2.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA25316; Thu, 30 Aug 90 15:34:06 -0400 Received: by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Thu, 30 Aug 90 15:33:07 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Thu, 30 Aug 90 15:33:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 30 Aug 90 15:32:04 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Received: from att-in.att.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Thu, 30 Aug 90 15:31:19 EDT From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!arpa!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 30 Aug 1990 14:56 EDT Subject: Sample DAT! Status: RO I neglected to mention in my last re-re-repost of Library options that I have a DAT machine in my studio. For any who also use DAT and wish to transport samples dat way, that's fine with me. It's especially good since DAT samples at the higher sampling rate (and as my last posting said, I can tranfer samples very easily with my system at the higher sampling rate without any conversion (of course, you do lose 4 bits worth of resolution. Hey, it's an imperfect world :-)). Once again, of limited use to most, perhaps, but any way we can expand the user-created sound library is to the advantage of all particpants. be good, gfd From gould!postmaster Sun Sep 2 15:45:48 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA00239; Sun, 2 Sep 90 15:45:47 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA28095; Mon, 3 Sep 90 06:34:28 EDT Received: from PO10.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA22797; Mon, 3 Sep 90 06:35:33 -0400 Received: by po10.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Mon, 3 Sep 90 06:34:25 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Mon, 3 Sep 90 06:34:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 3 Sep 90 06:33:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ifi.uio.no by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Mon, 3 Sep 90 06:32:34 EDT Received: from haar.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Mon, 3 Sep 1990 12:32:26 +0200 From: Thomas Flemming Received: by haar.ifi.uio.no ; Mon, 3 Sep 1990 12:32:24 +0200 Date: Mon, 3 Sep 1990 12:32:24 +0200 Message-Id: <9009031032.AAhaar02689@haar.ifi.uio.no> To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: Roland disk format Status: RO Todd, how's the disk-convert project going? Here's the table of data saved on disk from the W-30 owners manual, with my own notes on differences between W-30 and S-50. The table doesn't actually tell what information each byte contain, but can make it easier to find out wich order they appear. S-550,S-330 and W-30 disks are compatible so the differences between them should be minimal. Hope this can be any help. Thomas Flemming -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Table of data saved on an W-30 sound&song disk ...........System configuration.......... ...........Song data .................... sector parameter default ...........Patch-parameter...512 bytes on S-50, 256 on W-30....... 126 Patch name Space+0 Key mode Norm Key assign ROT Uni-detune 0 V-SW Tresh 64 V-Mix Ratio 0 Out-Level 127 Bend-Range 2 AT-Assign MOD At-Sense 0 Octave shift 0 Out assign Out 1 1st tone off 2nd tone off ..........Tone-parameter...128 bytes for S-50 and W-30.... 135 Tone-name 8xSpace+0 Orig.Tone not initalized (-- when deleted) Orig.key C5 P.Follow On P.Shift 0 Fine tune 0 P.LFO Depth 0 P.Bender On After touch On Out assign Out1 Out Level 127 Loop mode 1 shot Loop tune 0 [T1]-[T32] Start point [T1]-[T32] Loop point [T1]-[T32] End point [T33]-[T96] Start point This is W-30 ROM tones [T33]-[T96] Loop point [T33]-[T96] End point default 262143 LFO rate 88 LFO Sync On LFO mode Sin LFO Delay 0 LFO Offset 0 LFO Polarity + TVF Switch Off TVF cut off 127 TVF Resonance 0 TVF Key-follow 0 TVF LFO Depth 0 TVF EG depth 0 TVF L.curve 2 TVF EG Depth 0 TVF EG polarity + TVF Key rate 0 TVF Vel. Rate 0 TVF EG rate 1-8 127 TVF EG level1-2 127 TVF EG level3-8 0 TVF EG sus 2 TVF EG end 3 TVF Zoom 3 TVA LFO Depth. 0 TVA L.Curve 2 TVA Key rate 0 TVA Vel rate 0 TVA EG rate 1-8 127 TVA EG level1-2 127 TVA EG level3-8 0 TVA EG sus 2 TVA EG End 3 TVA zoom 3 ......Sample date....16 bytes each..same on S-50 and W-30......... 143 Tone-list or maybe some kind of directory Tone name 8xspace+0 Tone nr 0-1F Status 0 sample, 1 empty/available 5 unknown bytes 144-720 ...12bit waveform data............ From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Wed Sep 12 11:42:44 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA04198; Wed, 12 Sep 90 11:42:43 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA14046; Wed, 12 Sep 90 11:45:18 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA16308; Wed, 12 Sep 90 11:46:36 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Wed, 12 Sep 90 11:45:25 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 12 Sep 90 11:45:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 12 Sep 90 11:43:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Received: from att-in.att.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Wed, 12 Sep 90 11:43:02 EDT From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 12 Sep 1990 11:02 EDT Subject: Library Update and THE RULES! Status: RO Well, my friends, THe library has been steadily growing to good effect. I have just about finished re-org'ing the drum lib. So far, here's what we have: 1 disk kicks 1 disk snares 1 disk toms 1 disk congas, bongos, timbales 1 disk cymbals and probably 2 disks of assorted percussion. samples include M3r drums, RX-5, R100, Alesis HR 16, assorted samples from different records, and soon to be the complete R8 library. Considering that there is a considerable of disks for drums, I am going to do a couple of "best of" disks. One for more electronic "hot" sounds, one for "realistic, acoustic sounding" stuff. I'll send word when these are done. Also, I just did a really nice trumpet sample: mellow and fuzzy. A little detuning and it was a really nice "electronic sounding" horn. Get into it. Peace and Sample, gfd P.S. Don Tycholis seems to have fallen off the end of the earth. Has anyone heard from Don? P.S. Please read the guidelines below carefully before you send out disks. Response so far has been fairly good, but some mix-ups have occured. No fun. ======================Obtaining Samples from The S-Group===================== (revised 9/12/90) OK, here we go. Some very basic rules: 1. disks sent and received should not contain Roland library samples unless seriously (and usefully) deranged to the point of non-recognition. 2. Every disk you send should be FORMATTED (I have both S-50 and S-330/S-550) and labeled. Unformatted disks will likely be returned empty and unformatted. Make sure you make note what machine they are formatted for. 3. For every disk of sounds you send, you'll get the original back (tweaked if necessary and time permitting) plus 2 disks filled. That is, if you send me one sound disk and 2 additional empty FORMATTED disks, you get 3 full disks back. A note on what type of samples you would like would help me choose. Otherwise, I'll send out a "best of" series. Limit 10 disks total. 4. I had originally thought of limiting my activities to drum samples but I think I'll do whatever. Make a note that I'm not particularly interested in acoustic instrument samples (get a proteus) unless they are unusual or extremely good. 5. For the most part, I'm not going to spend a lot of time looping these samples because of the time involved. Nor will I do much vel-fades or splits or whatever. Expect tones, not patches. 6. Return addressed postage (you know, SASE) is mandatory. I need stamped addressed envelopes or I'll wait until you send them. Sorry, no exceptions. 7. For those of you who just want disks for nothing: if you send formatted disks, I'll send something back: WHEN TIME ALLOWS. It could be weeks, it could be months: no promises. Folks that send sounds: I'll do my best for a week turnaround. 8. Use your imagination. Nobody wants 20 samples from Star Trek no matter how cute they are. We're making music, not video games :-). 9. My Address: George Demarest 110 East Fairview Avenue South Plainfield, NJ 07080 (201) 957-6392 10. Sample everything! I especially like synth stuff, samples for House-type stuff, drum samples, noises. 11. Please, sample all sounds at 30K sampling rate. There really is a difference! 12. Send me e-mail describing what and when you are sending me. 13. Include a list of sounds that you have already gotten from me if applicable. 14. Please refrain from sending samples that you have bought from someone else. Not that I'm afraid of getting sued, more so that it's not fair to them. Do your own sampling! 15. Samples can be sent on DAT tape. I have DAT and an easy way of getting DAT data down to the samplers. Of course, don't send 60 minutes worth of samples on DAT, but if there is a stereo sample that you think is exceptional, send it on DAT. All tapes will be returned intact unless otherwise requested. 16. Samples must not be used to barter for Iraqi petroleum. =============================================================================== Sample List as of 9/12/90 Supplier Instrument Comments ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- D. Tycholis Yamaha RX-5* drum machine (complete) Neil Kawai R-100* drum machine (complete) (Neil) R. Walter Alesis HR-16* drum machine gfd Oberheim Matrix 1000 analog synth (2 full disks). bass sounds, square wave lead, electronic percussion-type sounds (in a kit). Neil Roland D-50 pads (half a disk) gfd Korg M3r (1 disk; others soon) Bass, lead sound, Acoustic Bass layered with conga (very nice). gfd Korg M3r* drum sounds gfd Korg SG-1D sampled grand (1 disk) sampled by a friend. Very interesting stereo effect makes you seem like you're "inside" the piano. very nice. all Miscelaneous guitar shots, CD player fast forwarding, chordal vocal samples, DX rhodes sound, others. ********* new releases!! ************** D. Tycholis Assorted Basses bass-type samples from DX7, Steinberger T. Flemming stabs & effects some stereo, brass, orchestral shots. T. Flemming stabs & synths more stabs, korg synths, synth basses. T. Flemming assorted voices speech clips such as "Hit it!", "This is a Journey into Sound" and others. T. Flemming JB samples Assorted James Brown Owws, Yeahs and other-worldy noises. Includes some groove samples. D. Tycholis MC Hammer Samples of raw instrumentals of "U Can't Touch Dis" including some choice quotes. This package includes a sequence disk for the Mac Sequencer "performer" that strings the samples together for an S-550. gfd trumpet samples mellow trumpet sound multi-sample. Sampled in my studio. Also hard attack. *note: all drum samples mentioned above are contained in the drum library and are not maintained "by machine" but by instrument. Requests for "all the M3r drum samples" will be met with a helpless look. :-< ============================================================================ From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Wed Sep 12 14:14:08 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA04722; Wed, 12 Sep 90 14:14:06 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA17442; Wed, 12 Sep 90 14:16:44 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA26097; Wed, 12 Sep 90 14:18:02 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Wed, 12 Sep 90 14:17:21 EDT Received: via switchmail; Wed, 12 Sep 90 14:17:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix7.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 12 Sep 90 14:16:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from unix7.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 12 Sep 90 14:16:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from VUI.Andrew.3.20.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.unix7.andrew.cmu.edu.vax.3 via MS.5.6.unix7.andrew.cmu.edu.vax_3; Wed, 12 Sep 90 14:16:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 12 Sep 90 14:16:02 -0400 (EDT) From: Neil Anthony Herzinger To: Sgroup Subject: Prosonus SampleNet Status: RO The following is reprinted from the pages of Septembers Keyboard magazine without any permission whatsoever... They're mad as hell and they ain't gonna take it any more. To battle against sample piracy and maintain a support network for registered customers-as well as to improve their own chances of survival-Prosomus has formed SampleNet, a cooperative organization that consists of Prosonus and its music dealers and customers. By becoming a full-fledged SampleNet member ($149.95), you gain access to the expanding Prodisk DDD library (a series of digitally recorded, processed, and transferred-thus DDD-ready to play samples and patches on 3.5" floppy disks formatted for all the popular samplers) and get two sets of Prodisk DDD sample disks, two special-edition Prodisds, the Prosonus Studio Reference Disc, a subscription to the ProSampler newsletter, discounts of up to 20% on all Prosonus products, and discounts of up to 40% on specific sampling hardware, such as blank 3.5" disks and 44Mv Syquest hard disk cartridges. Can't afford to be a full member? Perhaps you'd profer an Associate SampleNet Membership ($19.95), which provides full access to the Prodisk DDD library, two special-edition Prodisds, and a subscription to the ProSampler newsletter. Sounds pretty interesting. Anybody pursue it yet? The Associate price of $20 sounds like a great deal for full access to the disk library. I'm not sure what formats they are in, but they have to at least have S550 format. neil From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Thu Sep 13 00:27:48 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA01198; Thu, 13 Sep 90 00:27:47 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA02448; Thu, 13 Sep 90 00:27:30 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA09890; Thu, 13 Sep 90 00:29:19 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Thu, 13 Sep 90 00:27:22 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Thu, 13 Sep 90 00:27:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 13 Sep 90 00:26:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from saqqara.cis.ohio-state.edu by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Thu, 13 Sep 90 00:22:21 EDT Received: by saqqara.cis.ohio-state.edu (5.61-kk/5.900912) id AA13784; Wed, 12 Sep 90 23:46:46 -0400 Received: by david.UUCP (smail3.0) id AA00574; 12 Sep 90 23:44:00 EDT (Wed) To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: Hacker mode? Message-Id: <9009122343.AA00570@david.UUCP> Date: 12 Sep 90 23:43:57 EDT (Wed) From: gould!cis.ohio-state.edu!david!david (David A. Roth) Status: RO A friend of mine as a favor to me used DART(tm) on the Mac to dump the entire contents of the Roland S-330 System Disk 2 Multi Patch (as labeled) Ver. 1.00 to a single file (over 700k). I then used the UNIX 'strings' utility to look through some of it. I found what I expected which was most of the text you see appear on the monitor while using the Roland S-330. I did see a reference made to "Hacker mode" which I have never heard of before or have any idea what it is or if we can access it. The following is an abstract of the 'strings' output on that file: --------------------------------- 4e N4 Loading 68t f&5& f$1$ f$1$4 4f8t Hacker mode Save UT Go Utility Ver # disp Tone map >> Save UT-SYS &d&( --------------------------------- Anyone have any ideas what this Hacker mode stuff is all about? I don't recall seeing the work Hacker used anywhere on the S-330 or the manual. Perhaps I missed something. David ------------------------------------------------------------------------ _TT /| |~ >====ttt===< | O| |~ att!osu-cis!david!david {_|||_} \| O| or n8emr!david!david David A. Roth uunet!abvax!osu-cis!david!david From CompuServ: send >internet:david@david.uucp ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Tue Sep 18 21:11:11 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA19545; Tue, 18 Sep 90 21:11:08 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA14185; Tue, 18 Sep 90 21:25:49 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA00472; Tue, 18 Sep 90 21:26:20 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Tue, 18 Sep 90 21:24:49 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 18 Sep 90 21:24:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 18 Sep 90 21:22:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Received: from att-in.att.com (att.att.com) by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Tue, 18 Sep 90 21:22:04 EDT From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!arpa!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 18 Sep 1990 16:29 EDT Subject: NO MORE RULES!!! Status: RO Well, The library is growing daily. So are the guidelines I have devised. I should mention that if anyone feels that any of my terms are inappropriate, drop me a line and we can discuss it. I think they're fair, but then I would, now wouldn't I?? :-) I will, however, refrain from sending out such large files from now on. I will simply drop a line now and then letting people know about exciting new additions to the library. The rule that I stress most in all of this is that you contact me before you put anything in the mail to me. When I know that someone will send me something, I will send a listing of the current library and the most revised version of the guidelines (I think GUIDLINES sounds much nicer than RULES, don't you? :-). Thus: I finally got the Alesis HR-16 samples from my friend. I am still working on the Roland R8 sounds: should happen within a couple of weeks. Also, as mentioned before, Don Tycholis is at present unable to send out messages from his machine. I spoke to him on the phone the other day and he assured me of existence. He also mentioned that someday, he will get around to doing those fabled guitar samples "if we beg". I might add that this is a perfect time to start a rumour that Don T. eats worms, since Don can't possibly defend himself... :-) Peace and Samples to all, George P.S. Neil, you may want to let me know whenever we add new members so that I can send them the sample sampler. From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Mon Sep 24 18:03:39 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA13519; Mon, 24 Sep 90 18:03:37 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA18528; Mon, 24 Sep 90 18:02:03 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA10368; Mon, 24 Sep 90 14:07:27 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Mon, 24 Sep 90 14:06:51 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Mon, 24 Sep 90 14:06:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 24 Sep 90 14:05:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from WLV.IMSD.CONTEL.COM by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Mon, 24 Sep 90 14:04:41 EDT Received: from WLBR.IMSD.CONTEL.COM by WLV.IMSD.CONTEL.COM (5.64/1.25) id AA12329; Mon, 24 Sep 90 11:04:10 -0700 Received: by WLBR.IMSD.CONTEL.COM (5.61++/1.25) id AA02159; Mon, 24 Sep 90 10:42:59 -0700 Date: Mon, 24 Sep 90 10:42:59 -0700 From: gould!wlv.imsd.contel.com!pete%WLBR (Pete Lyall) Message-Id: <9009241742.AA02159@WLBR.IMSD.CONTEL.COM> To: cis.ohio-state.edu!david!david, cis.ohio-state.edu!osu-cis!att!twitch!midi, andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: Re: ART MultiVerb causing loud hum in my S-330. Any suggestions? Status: RO Also - check on your 3 prong plugs. Ground loops are notorious hum producers, as are shielded (!) cables passing by power strips and those little DC tramsfromers. The best way to troubleshoot hum is to put on a set of headphones (run out of the mixer or amp) and start unplugging and disconnecting stuff until it becomes lesser or goes away. Hum can be the product of many problems. Also, don't underestimate the importance of GOOD cable - everywhere. I built all of my own using Belden and Switchcraft parts, but am now going to SoundFlex commercially produced cables ($ - ouch). Pete From gould!xerox.com!Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B Wed Oct 3 17:20:33 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA18395; Wed, 3 Oct 90 17:20:32 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA15112; Wed, 3 Oct 90 17:42:22 EDT Received: from alpha.Xerox.COM by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA25430; Wed, 3 Oct 90 17:43:01 -0400 Received: from LAX1B_Mail_Service_2.LAX1B.Xerox.xns by alpha.xerox.com via XNS id <16468>; Wed, 3 Oct 1990 14:43:19 PDT X-Ns-Transport-Id: 0000AA007A1873242ABE Date: Wed, 3 Oct 1990 14:40:37 PDT Sender: gould!xerox.com!Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B From: gould!xerox.com!DTycholis.LAX1B Subject: Re: Samples via e-mail. (R/W Roland disk on the Mac) In-Reply-To: "ESC%riverside.scrc.symbolics:COM:Xerox's message of 15-August-90 (Wednesday) 16:12:56 PDT" To: riverside.scrc.symbolics.COM!ESC Cc: xerox.com!DTycholis.LAX1B, encore.COM!dlaw, andrew.cmu.EDU!sgroup+ Message-Id: <" 3-Oct-90 14:40:37 PDT".*.Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B@Xerox.com> Status: RO True, there's no way to initiate the tone/patch dump from the S-550. The idea of embedding the sysex bytes (almost sounds sexy doesn't it) seems feasible. I might try it, just as soon as I bail out the swamp under my house....8-). {10/3: course, now that it's all fixed, I'll have to find some ohter excuse not to get around to it :-)} Actually, there is some handshaking involved in the DT1 protocol (256 byte fragments), so it probably won't get you more than just the first 256 byte chunk of a tone. There is a faster, large transfer protocol (DTR?) which I haven't figured out yet that *might* work when sent by a sequencer, but then we get into the "over-running of the sequencer" problem you mentioned. Still, it's a thought....if only I had a rack-mounted phase-correcting Time Wrinkler(TM) so I could retreat into my computer lab/studio/closet for a few days, and emerge triumphantly with my latest gift to mankind, 2 minutes later 8-). It seems like we need a S-Series Sample Librarian program (no, relax, we aren't looking to replace you, george). Anyone know of such a product? Does Sound Designer or Alchemy Jr. (what's it really called?) provide this function? Don From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Sat Oct 6 15:34:56 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA04767; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:34:55 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA03923; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:36:33 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA03694; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:35:02 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:34:12 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:34:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:08:56 -0400 (EDT) Received: from hub.ucsb.edu by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:08:15 EDT Received: from ivucsb.UUCP by hub.ucsb.edu; id AA29580 sendmail 4.0/UCSB-2.0-sun via UUCP Sat, 6 Oct 90 12:06:11 PDT for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu Received: by ivucsb.sba.ca.us (smail2.5) id AA06064; 6 Oct 90 12:04:19 PDT (Sat) Subject: S50 <--> IBMPC converter program To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ (Roland Support Group) Date: Sat, 6 Oct 90 12:04:15 PDT Organization: QuickSilver Rallye Team, Santa Barbara, CA X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL4] Message-Id: <9010061204.AA06064@ivucsb.sba.ca.us> From: gould!ivucsb.sba.ca.us!todd (Todd Day) Status: RO Okay, I'm back from vacationing, back from rallying, most of my stuff is moved into my new place, and my job is finally getting under control... It's time to start up work on the S50 disk converter program. I want your ideas... what kind of conversion are you going to need? Do you want to be able to do both patch sets (the patch plus all of it's associated sounds)? Whole disks? Individual sounds? I could make an archiver out of it, too. It'd be able to dump all the title info about your disk and all of the patches and sounds on it into a generic ASCII file so you could put it into some database program on your PC. I'm going to make it work on my UNIXPC first, and then I'll take it to work and port it using TurboC on a IBMPC type machine. So tell me, what do you want to be able to do with it? BTW, the reason I'm doing this is that I want to be able to take the file dump, convert it to some uuencoded format, and then send the samples via email. That reminds me... I want to come up with some format other than uuencode that will take advantage of lower case characters... any know of any caveats vis a vi sending ASCII over the net? -- Todd Day | todd@ivucsb.sba.ca.us | ucsbcsl!ivucsb!todd It's not a matter of winning or losing... It's how much tread you scrub off your tires! From gould!po2.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Sat Oct 6 15:36:24 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA04780; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:36:23 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA03933; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:38:01 EDT Received: from PO2.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA03711; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:36:35 -0400 Received: by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:36:04 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Sat, 6 Oct 90 15:36:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 6 Oct 90 14:33:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ATHENA.MIT.EDU by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Sat, 6 Oct 90 14:33:17 EDT Received: from SAL.MIT.EDU by ATHENA.MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA17606; Sat, 6 Oct 90 14:33:13 EDT From: gould!athena.mit.edu!paul Received: by sal.MIT.EDU (5.61/4.7) id AA17473; Sat, 6 Oct 90 14:33:05 -0400 Date: Sat, 6 Oct 90 14:33:05 -0400 Message-Id: <9010061833.AA17473@sal.MIT.EDU> To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: Re: Roland Samplers and Floppy Disk Woes.... Status: RO The same happened to me with several disks, most of them two years old, most of them my most heavily-used disks. I bought a $5 head cleaner, used it, and used Load Patch and Load Tone to stubbornly read the missing data off the bad tracks. I was able to read all data from the half dozen bad disks. I then reformatted the disks and rewrote the data onto them, which solved the problem short-term until I could steal some more floppies from work and copy the questionable disks onto them. Since using the cleaning disks, I have not had this problem. I posted this to rec.music.something last year and was told that 1) You should never clean a disk drive ever, and it was nmy fault for not keeping a pristine environment 2) cleaning disks are bad for your disk drive, and only people who really know what they're doing can clean the disk by dissembling it. I chose to disbelieve both replies. I have used my disk drive quite extensively since then with no problems. Incidentally, I just received some wild Norwegian sample disks (Thank you Mr Flemming!) and used the belligerent-reread technique to get the sounds off a couple of travel-damaged sectors. -Paul From gould!hub.ucsb.edu!ivucsb!todd Tue Oct 9 10:49:51 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA15293; Tue, 9 Oct 90 10:49:50 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA04837; Tue, 9 Oct 90 10:51:35 EDT Received: from hub.ucsb.edu by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA09968; Tue, 9 Oct 90 02:49:41 -0400 Received: from ivucsb.UUCP by hub.ucsb.edu; id AA13874 sendmail 4.0/UCSB-2.0-sun via UUCP Mon, 8 Oct 90 23:47:37 PDT for dlaw@encore.com Received: by ivucsb.sba.ca.us (smail2.5) id AA11973; 8 Oct 90 23:33:35 PDT (Mon) Subject: Re: S50 <--> IBMPC converter program To: encore.com!dlaw (Don Law) Date: Mon, 8 Oct 90 23:33:32 PDT In-Reply-To: <9010081336.AA15211@encore.encore.com>; from "Don Law" at Oct 8, 90 9:36 am Organization: QuickSilver Rallye Team, Santa Barbara, CA X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL4] Message-Id: <9010082333.AA11973@ivucsb.sba.ca.us> From: gould!ivucsb.sba.ca.us!todd (Todd Day) Status: RO %What I'd like to do is take samples from the %net and convert them to a dump I can send to the S-10 in a sysex Aha! So if I provided you with the format of the binary dump, you could do the sysex thing? -- Todd Day | todd@ivucsb.sba.ca.us | ucsbcsl!ivucsb!todd It's not a matter of winning or losing... It's how much tread you scrub off your tires! From gould!po2.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Tue Oct 9 10:51:44 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA15329; Tue, 9 Oct 90 10:51:43 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA04981; Tue, 9 Oct 90 10:53:22 EDT Received: from PO2.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA04378; Mon, 8 Oct 90 21:51:59 -0400 Received: by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Mon, 8 Oct 90 21:51:28 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Mon, 8 Oct 90 21:51:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 8 Oct 90 21:50:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Mon, 8 Oct 90 21:48:48 EDT Received: from LAX1B_Mail_Service_5.LAX1B.Xerox.xns by alpha.xerox.com via XNS id <16137>; Mon, 8 Oct 1990 18:49:16 PDT X-Ns-Transport-Id: 0000AA00CA5D01902ACF Date: Mon, 8 Oct 1990 18:48:09 PDT From: gould!xerox.com!Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B Subject: Re: Roland Samplers and Floppy Disk Woes.... In-Reply-To: "paul@athena.mit:edu:Xerox's message of 6-October-90 (Saturday) 11:33:05 PDT" To: athena.mit.edu!paul Cc: xerox.com!Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B, andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Message-Id: <" 8-Oct-90 18:48:09 PDT".*.Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B@Xerox.com> Status: RO Well, guess I'll try a floppy disk cleaner this weekend, and see if it helps recover the disks. I had waffled on this earlier, since the errors are "solid" and repeatable only on specific disks. A dirty head *should * give semi-random errors, or errors on most all the disks, no? But it can't hurt to clean them, right (uh oh, here come the flames!?)...WARNING: hit "next" if you don't want to hear my opinion on head cleaning! I too have heard all the arguments pro and con. Yes, it probably is best to go the "professional cleaning approach" which is to disassemble the gear, get in to the disk head directly, swab it gently with head cleaning fluid and a cotton Q-tip, etc. ( If it is interesting to anyone, I was once a professional disk head cleaner, for Control Data Corporation Customer Engineering: factory trained on CDC Model 844 and 819 HD's.) "Doing it right" works, if you know what you're doing. It's also a pain, usually. So, most people would probably rather take their chances on the head cleaning kit than to risk doing some real ugly damage by opening up and digging into their expensive toys with metal tools; this is a perfectly rational decision, one that I've made several times :-) The head cleaning kits (the wet kind) have worked for me on several types of systems without any adverse effects. So maybe both sides are right? IMHO, the key is to use a "quality kit" (i.e. not abrasive), make sure the floppy-cleaning material is wet enough, and stop cleaning before the material gets dry. If a light wet cleaning won't do it, you've got a scratched or marred head surface which requires "burnishing" with a special polishing material, and you've got to pull the head out of the drive to do this. On the el-cheapo floppy drives we use today, this means trash-can the drive and go buy a new one. Thanks for the prod, and thanks for the "Load Patch and Load Tone- RIP the face off the floppy" read tip. I'll give it a go with the cleaner. If that doesn't work, I'll "do it right` :-)... Don From gould!encore!dlaw Tue Oct 9 11:16:56 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA15475; Tue, 9 Oct 90 11:16:55 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA06041; Tue, 9 Oct 90 11:18:42 EDT Received: by encore.encore.com (5.64/25-eef) id AA08580; Tue, 9 Oct 90 11:17:25 -0400 Date: Tue, 9 Oct 90 11:17:25 -0400 From: Don Law Message-Id: <9010091517.AA08580@encore.encore.com> To: ivucsb.sba.ca.us!todd Subject: Re: S50 <--> IBMPC converter program Cc: dlaw Status: RO > Aha! So if I provided you with the format of the binary dump, > you could do the sysex thing? That is my plan. I'm have the sysex dump format for my S-10, and I either have or can get the format for standard MIDI tracks. So what I plan to do is write a program to take the s-group binary files (either from the net or from the 3.5" disks) and convert it to a MIDI track containing the needed sysex (the "transformation" below). Here is the overall path: network my unix box IBMPC here at work (your binary ===> (C program does ===> (transfer to floppy ===> file) transformation here) using PC-NFS). IBMPC at home (send sysex from ===> Roland S-10 MIDI track with Cakewalk) --Don Law dlaw@encore.com ...!uunet!gould!dlaw --Ada Development, MS404 --Encore Computer Corporation ***** In the computer lab, ***** --Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33313 ***** No one can hear you scream. ***** From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Thu Oct 11 10:33:34 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA07773; Thu, 11 Oct 90 10:33:32 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA12751; Thu, 11 Oct 90 10:34:51 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA25531; Thu, 11 Oct 90 10:33:44 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Thu, 11 Oct 90 10:33:16 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Thu, 11 Oct 90 10:33:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 11 Oct 90 10:29:03 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Received: from att.att.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Thu, 11 Oct 90 10:24:30 EDT From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 11 Oct 1990 9:30 EDT Subject: S-330 format Status: RO > Someone sent me a disk dump of the S-330 format. I examined > it tonight and found a few interesting things. > > It appears from the system code that the S-330 can read and > write S-50 disks. Yes, the actual code to do so resides on the S-330 utilities disk. > It also appears that it has a mouse and one can enter some > "Hacker Mode". This has been discussed. I've never seen it, but rumor has it that it exists. > The S-330 is a twelve bit sampler with 16 bit output. I've never been too sure, but that sounds right. I've seen literature calling it both 12-bit and 16-bit, so your description sounds like it has merit. > Any of the above true? You're doing well so far, dude. > Anyway, the directory format and data format are VERY similar > to the S-50 format. However, they have different offsets > (does the S-330 use those damned 2.5" disks?). So, it seems > that > A) there won't be any problem just reading and > writing S-50 disks, so why bother doing a > port to the S-330. > B) if I do decide to port, it won't be all that > hard, anyway. I think what I'll do is write > the code in such a manner as to make offsets > variable and therefore easily changed for > the S-330. > > I'm tempted to do just A, because that way we won't have > a proliferation of different formats. However, I'm concerned > that there might be something in the S-330 and S-550 that > will get lost in the translation to the S-50. Can anyone > confirm this? The S-330 has additional filtering data that the S-50 doesn't have. This might make up for the difference in offsets. Also, the S-330 has 8 more available patch memories per disk. This would correspond to additional patch parameters, splits, etc. The S-550 is similar thought there may be some differences. gfd From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Thu Oct 11 15:01:28 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA09467; Thu, 11 Oct 90 15:01:26 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA19205; Thu, 11 Oct 90 15:02:47 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA05992; Thu, 11 Oct 90 15:01:43 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Thu, 11 Oct 90 15:00:26 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Thu, 11 Oct 90 15:00:14 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 11 Oct 90 14:59:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ifi.uio.no by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Thu, 11 Oct 90 14:57:22 EDT Received: from skakke.ifi.uio.no by ifi.uio.no with SMTP id ; Thu, 11 Oct 1990 19:55:20 +0100 From: Thomas Flemming Received: by skakke.ifi.uio.no ; Thu, 11 Oct 1990 19:55:18 +0100 Date: Thu, 11 Oct 1990 19:55:18 +0100 Message-Id: <9010111855.AAskakke28267@skakke.ifi.uio.no> To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ (Roland Support Group) Subject: Flemming's lib. list Status: RO Here's my updatet list of self-sampled disks: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Stabs & Synths 1: Stereo orchestral hits and effects,synths. Taken from CD's and other various sources. Stabs & Synths 2: Mono hits, stabs & analog Korg synths. These are not presets! Percussion Library: Assorted 909 and 808 with dope bass, funky drummer loop and other percussive sounds. Bolero: Do it yourself kit. Ravel's Bolero loop'ed and other orchestral samples. James Brown: I haven't sampled this myself. Contains the usual sex machine quotes, and the oooh and yeah often used as percussion. Vocal samples: A selection of old vocal samples like this is journey into... and keep this frequence clear. Mainly taken from records. Alesis 16B 1: Tones 1-30 from the drum-machine, all the snares ,bassdrums and toms. Alesis 16B 2: Tones 31-47, long cymbal-samples and the most unusal sounds. Also some extra samples to fill up the disk. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Since I have a W-30, I can handle all formats. If you're not living in europe, then you can send your request to George. I'm always interested in swapping disk with interesting sounds. Thomas Flemming Gydasvei 74 . . 1413 TARNASEN NORWAY From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Sat Oct 13 13:43:10 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA16051; Sat, 13 Oct 90 13:43:09 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA06346; Sat, 13 Oct 90 13:43:13 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA07246; Sat, 13 Oct 90 13:43:48 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Sat, 13 Oct 90 13:42:23 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Sat, 13 Oct 90 13:42:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 13 Oct 90 13:40:18 -0400 (EDT) Received: from saqqara.cis.ohio-state.edu by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Sat, 13 Oct 90 13:39:59 EDT Received: by saqqara.cis.ohio-state.edu (5.61-kk/5.900920) id AA13783; Sat, 13 Oct 90 13:38:52 -0400 Received: by david.UUCP (smail3.0) id AA01499; 13 Oct 90 13:37:54 EDT (Sat) To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Subject: Forwarded mail to sgroup Message-Id: <9010131337.AA01495@david.UUCP> Date: 13 Oct 90 13:37:48 EDT (Sat) From: gould!cis.ohio-state.edu!david!david (David A. Roth) Status: RO From uucp Sat Oct 13 06:34 EDT 1990 From abvax!uunet!mailrus!umich!vela!swood Sat Oct 13 06:34:30 1990 remote from saqqara.cis.ohio-state.edu Received: by david.UUCP (smail3.0) id AA00847; 13 Oct 90 06:34:30 EDT (Sat) Received: by cis.ohio-state.edu (smail2.5) id AA28602; 13 Oct 90 06:18:34 EDT (Sat) Received: by abvax.icd.ab.com (5.59/1.17l); id AA06056; Sat, 13 Oct 90 05:23:06 EDT Received: from mailrus.UUCP by uunet.uu.net (5.61/1.14) with UUCP id AA22303; Sat, 13 Oct 90 05:10:02 -0400 Received: by mailrus.cc.umich.edu (5.61/1123-1.0) id AA17928; Sat, 13 Oct 90 02:14:35 -0400 Received: by umich.edu (5.61/1123-1.0) id AA05480; Thu, 4 Oct 90 16:31:16 -0400 From: abvax!uunet!mailrus!umich!vela!swood (Scott Wood - EVENSONG) Message-Id: <9010042026.AA19731@vela.acs.oakland.edu> Subject: no subject (file transmission) To: umich!vela.acs.oakland.edu!swood (Scott Wood (vela account)), umich!hpmcpjh.mcm.hp.com!patrick (Patrick J. Hawke), umich!x102c.ess.harris.com!jlee (John Lee), umich!prl.philips.co.uk!davidw (David Walker), umich!terminator.cc.umich.edu!weiner (Jeff Weiner), umich!daydreams.sun.com!bfrench (Bill French), umich!ux5.lbl.gov!wayneh (Wayne Hurlbert), umich!sgi.com!shiba%riffnique.csd (Richard Shiba), uiucdcs!convex!stager (Gary Stager), osu-cis!david!david (David A. Roth), medsys!hal (Hal Dougherty), umich!hpcsd02.col.hp.com!don (Don Allison), umich!ifi.uio.no!thomasfl (Thomas Flemming), umich!convex1.convex.com!rosenkra (William Rosencranz), umich!arkell.cs.ubc.ca!mgobbi (Mike Gobbi), umich!DG-RTP.DG.COM!kan (Victor Kan), umich!dsv.su.se!fk (Fredrick Kilander), lotus!voyager.lotus.com!rmurtha (Rob Murtha), umich!gsbsun.uchicago.edu!ron (Ronald J. Rangel), umich!gorby.src.honeywell.com!kooyman (Jerome Kooyman) Date: Thu, 4 Oct 90 16:26:09 EDT X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL6] Status: RO From: Thomas Flemming Subject: stug To: swood@vela.acs.oakland.edu Date: Thu, 4 Oct 1990 20:56:13 +0100 Wood, isn't there a way to avoid those long address list in the begining of each mail? Here's something about me: Equipment: 1040 ST, Monchrome monitor Roland W-30 workstation At the time I'm a student a the University of Oslo (Norway). I'm working on a program to read and write sampler-disk dircetly with the ST's internal drive. If I succeed maybe I could for instance convert S-900 samples to Roland S-50/550/330 with the Atari. If anyone else have got the same idea please give me a note. Thomas Flemming From gould!po9.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Sun Oct 14 11:18:18 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA18295; Sun, 14 Oct 90 11:18:17 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA28235; Sun, 14 Oct 90 11:18:21 EDT Received: from PO9.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA12723; Sun, 14 Oct 90 11:19:03 -0400 Received: by po9.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Sun, 14 Oct 90 11:18:45 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Sun, 14 Oct 90 11:18:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sun, 14 Oct 90 11:16:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from saqqara.cis.ohio-state.edu by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Sun, 14 Oct 90 11:16:29 EDT Received: by saqqara.cis.ohio-state.edu (5.61-kk/5.900920) id AA04039; Sun, 14 Oct 90 11:15:26 -0400 Received: by david.UUCP (smail3.0) id AA03355; 14 Oct 90 11:15:15 EDT (Sun) To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Message-Id: <9010141115.AA03351@david.UUCP> Date: 14 Oct 90 11:15:12 EDT (Sun) From: gould!cis.ohio-state.edu!david!david (David A. Roth) Status: RO Path: david!n8emr!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!wuarchive!uunet!maverick.ksu.ksu.edu!hoss!fergvax!252u3129 From: 252u3129@fergvax.unl.edu (Mike Gleason) Newsgroups: rec.music.newage,rec.music.classical,alt.rock-n-roll,rec.music.country.western Subject: Digitized Sound FTP Site Summary: Submissions Wanted Message-ID: <1990Oct11.071149.17858@hoss.unl.edu> Date: 11 Oct 90 07:11:49 GMT Sender: news@hoss.unl.edu (Network News Administer) Organization: Univ. of Nebr. Lines: 16 Xref: david rec.music.newage:1683 rec.music.classical:156 alt.rock-n-roll:348 Anyone out there with sound digitizers? I am co-moderating an FTP site devoted to digital samples (kinda like graphic GIFs only you play them back to listen to instead of look at), and we have started a section devoted to samples of actual songs. If you have any sounds to submit, please send your uuencoded samples (in the usual macintosh format which can be played on many platforms) to me. If you would just like to download what we do have, FTP over to ccb.ucsf.eud (128.218.1.13) and look in the Pub/Sound_list/Song directory. So far we only have a few backwards messages unbackwarded and a few hard-rock samples, so we are especially looking for alternative, classical, country-western, and non-hard rock samples. _____________________________________________________________________________ * Mike Gleason 252u3129@fergvax.unl.edu * "Don't you f*ckin' look at me!" -- D. Hopper cosc006@unlcdc2.unl.edu From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Wed Oct 17 12:42:50 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA15300; Wed, 17 Oct 90 12:42:49 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA06054; Wed, 17 Oct 90 13:13:14 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA07553; Wed, 17 Oct 90 13:14:43 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Wed, 17 Oct 90 13:10:48 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 17 Oct 90 13:10:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 17 Oct 90 13:09:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for sgroup+; Wed, 17 Oct 90 13:06:13 EDT Received: from LAX1B_Mail_Service_5.LAX1B.Xerox.xns by alpha.xerox.com via XNS id <16295>; Wed, 17 Oct 1990 10:05:17 PDT X-Ns-Transport-Id: 0000AA00CA5D02602ACF Date: Wed, 17 Oct 1990 10:04:22 PDT Sender: gould!xerox.com!Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B From: gould!xerox.com!DTycholis.LAX1B Subject: Re: Flemming's Lib In-Reply-To: "sjs@btr:com:Xerox's message of 15-October-90 (Monday) 14:52:21 PDT" To: andrew.cmu.edu!sgroup+ Cc: btr.com!sjs Message-Id: <"17-Oct-90 10:04:22 PDT".*.Donald_C._Tycholis.LAX1B@Xerox.com> Status: RO I am forwarding this to the Sgroup as it was sent directly to me ( by accident, I assume). My personal response follows.... ------------------------------- I need some ideas of stuff to sample so that I can trade for the HR-16 samples and the R-8 samples and some of the other stuff I have been reading about. But what can I sample that would be of interest. I have an M1 and a DW-8000. Would synth samples be good for you all. How about some MIDI stack samples? later sjs@btr.com --------------------------------- M1, DW-8000, or stacked multisamples would be great! my preference is for those timbres which are somewhat unique or characteristic of a particular synth. When there is a choice of sounds (due to velocity-response, etc.), slightly agressive sounds are preferable, as they can be toned down (as desired) with post-processing. It's tough to liven up a too-mellow/subtle sample without adding noise. Thanks in advance for contributing to the sample library, Don From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Wed Oct 17 15:29:23 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA16990; Wed, 17 Oct 90 15:29:21 EDT Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA10081; Wed, 17 Oct 90 15:59:46 EDT Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA14053; Wed, 17 Oct 90 16:01:16 -0400 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Wed, 17 Oct 90 15:57:56 EDT Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 17 Oct 90 15:57:51 -0400 (EDT) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 17 Oct 90 15:56:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: Received: from att.att.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Wed, 17 Oct 90 15:55:54 EDT From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 17 Oct 1990 14:38 EDT Subject: Sample idea sampler Status: RO > I need some ideas of stuff to sample so that I can trade for the HR-16 > samples and the R-8 samples and some of the other stuff I have been reading > about. But what can I sample that would be of interest. I have an M1 and a > DW-8000. Would synth samples be good for you all. How about some MIDI stack > samples? > > later > > sjs@btr.com > > --------------------------------- > > M1, DW-8000, or stacked multisamples would be great! my preference is for > those timbres which are somewhat unique or characteristic of a particular > synth. Here they are: 10 quick sampling ideas (beyond getting the M1 and DW-8000 sounds (I personally would love some of the classic DW-8000 brass, strings and clav-type sounds)) 1. Take a synth sound that will sustain. Jam the sustain pedal to get an infinite sound. Put your sampler 3 rooms away and run a garden hose from the speaker to the sampler room (where there is a mic). SAMPLE IT. 2. Get a coffee can (empty, half-full, half full with water, jello) close mic it, send output to a chorus, delay or gated reverb. Sample outout of effect. 3. Get an old, old record player (with an indestructible stylus). Take output and put it into a guitar amp. Lift the needle 3 inches. DROP. Let bounce, scrape, kneed, cool on rack and add herbs. mic output of guitar amp. Works well with chipmunk records slowed down so you can tell that Alvin is played by Merv Griffin. SAMPLE IT. 4. Turn on your television to a basketball game. mic the TV speaker and attempt to isolate sneaker noise on gym floor. Put it through any effect you may have. Nike's seem to squeak a lot. 5. Play as many octaves and 5th of a single tone on both of your synths. Have both sustain indefinitely. Put the output speaker (good, or cheap) in your garage. Turn it up loud. Place the mic 10 feet from the speaker in a metal pail. SAMPLE IT. 6. Have a friend (preferably naked) in the next room. Put a mic very close the adjoining wall and have your friend hit the wall with various parts of his/her body. SAMPLE IT. 7. Borrow a portable cassette (a poor quality micro-cassette could be ideal) and close mic any sustained or percussive sound (motor running, fog horn, someone taking a hammer to a dead fish, etc). SAMPLE IT. 8. Take a synth put and put it through a long reverb. Set the reverb so that its output is 100% effect (ie no original signal). Sample that. Short and long. 9. Take a wooden ruler, place it on a desk so that a good 8 inches hang off the edge, apply pressure downward on the part over the desk and with the other hand, pluck the other end (note: this was done with great effect on one of the Art of Noise albums. None the worse for already having been done). 10. Bring your sampler to work. Put a mic near the top of your desk. Pound on your desk with your fist until someone comes in and screams. Sample the fist AND the screams. 11. You get the idea. Zillions of sounds out there to be found, taken and used. Never discount the idea of using outboard effects as part of the sample itself. Sample in Peace, gfd From gould!po2.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Wed Oct 31 10:34:48 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA19006; Wed, 31 Oct 90 10:34:45 EST Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA01818; Wed, 31 Oct 90 10:35:45 EST Received: from PO2.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA13497; Wed, 31 Oct 90 10:35:56 -0500 Received: by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Wed, 31 Oct 90 10:36:14 EST Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 31 Oct 90 10:36:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 31 Oct 90 10:33:54 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Received: from att.att.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Wed, 31 Oct 90 10:33:10 EST From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 31 Oct 1990 9:14 EST Subject: Sampling with the S-330 Status: RO > I'm a neophyte S-330 user... I did try to get a bit of sampling started, but > found that the sound seemed to be mapped to all keys (and all channels?).. > > How do I map the tone/patch so that I can have several channels and > key ranges with separate tones? The 330 manual isn't all that helpful... OK, for the S-330 or S-50, there are 32 slots for "tones". A "patch" is a collection of tones (or 1 tone) and some additional parameters (tuning, volume, bend range, etc). If you wish to map more than 1 tone to a patch, you must enter the "split" function in the "edit" menu. Ordinarily, when I multi-sample an instrument (ie sample from different registers of the same sound) I will take 3 or 4 samples, usually about an octave and a half apart, depending on the tone. Let's say that I sampled 3 tones into slots 11, 12, 13. I go into the split menu, get a midi keyboard set up select to tone I want (I'll start with the lowest tone, 11). I then change the tone function from "info" to "1st tone" or "1st and 2nd tone" (doesn't matter unless I am doing a crossfade or vel-switch). I then play on the midi keyboard the range of notes that this tone will be mapped to (let's say the lowest 2 octaves). I then change the selected tone (1st tone) to tone 12, play the middle 2 octaves, etc. Pretty straight forward. Also, something to keep in mind, when you're sampling, only have one midi channel active in play mode. unbfortunately with uninitialized patches, tone 11 is the default tone, so it will sound on all those patches... Also, anyone on this list who uses the samplers without a monitor, I can't emphasize enough how useful it is. Get a cheapo monochrome monitor and plug it in. I think that the S-330 might even require one (?). A mouse I can do without, a monitor: no f***in' way! Hope this helps. gfd From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Thu Nov 1 10:43:39 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA23979; Thu, 1 Nov 90 10:43:37 EST Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA18192; Thu, 1 Nov 90 10:44:11 EST Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA01805; Thu, 1 Nov 90 10:44:44 -0500 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for henrik@eddie.mit.edu; Thu, 1 Nov 90 10:08:31 EST Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Thu, 1 Nov 90 10:08:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 1 Nov 90 10:02:50 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Received: from att.att.com (ATT-IN.ATT.COM) by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Thu, 1 Nov 90 10:02:12 EST From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 1 Nov 1990 9:23 EST Subject: Meese Appeal Status: RO Or is that Piece Meal? First an announcement: Thomas Flemming has sent in the Alesis HR16B drum machine samples to the lib. Included there are samples from the classic Roland TR808 and TR909 (if memory serves). I haven't finished EQ'ing etc (although they haven't needed much (nice job Thomas!)) yet but will by the weekend. Let me also remind you that the samples you send in don't have to be the worlds best. I'm not rating them. I will try to imrove on those that I can. But don't feel that your efforts are not "good enough". It's only your effort itself that motivates me to keep the lib moving. I've been pretty lame of late in the sampling dept. But that'll change soon. Those who wish for a current listing of the library, send me mail and I'll deal with it off line. If I get enough requests, I'll just post it. >I will be putting together some disks of DW-8000 and M1 sounds, as well as some > MIDI stacks of the both along with an MKS-20. I also am learning how to use > Turbosynth, and will be making some of those samples available. I'm > still trying to get the hang of looping, but if anyone wants to trade me > for un-looped samples, lets do it. I really want to expand my library. Samples don't have to be looped to go into the lib... > As I learn the art of looping, I will have some looped stuff available. Also, > if you have any samples that would make good partials for Turbosynth to build > upon, send them to me and I will try to create some cool renditions from the > original samples. Perhaps you should give examples of what sounds would typically work well with TurboSynth. Also what TurboSynth can do. I'm sure that I'm not the only one that would be interested in hearing about it. gfd From gould!po5.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Fri Nov 2 10:56:47 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA29499; Fri, 2 Nov 90 10:56:46 EST Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA02242; Fri, 2 Nov 90 10:57:22 EST Received: from PO5.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA10999; Fri, 2 Nov 90 10:57:59 -0500 Received: by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Fri, 2 Nov 90 10:54:22 EST Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Fri, 2 Nov 90 10:54:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 2 Nov 90 10:51:56 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Received: from att.att.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Fri, 2 Nov 90 10:50:51 EST From: gould!mtdca.att.com!gfd From: gould!mtdca.att.com!g.f.demarest To: mtdca.att.com!att!andrew.cmu.edu!Sgroup+ Date: 2 Nov 1990 10:19 EST Subject: Sam Ash blowing out S-330 Status: RO Just to let you know that Sam Ash is blowing out the Roland S-330 sampler for $1095 right now. A fine machine as you all know. Free enlistment in the Sgroup for all takers :-)... gfd From gould!po10.andrew.cmu.edu:nh0n+!andrew.cmu.edu! Fri Nov 2 12:56:32 1990 Received: by ranger (5.54/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA00281; Fri, 2 Nov 90 12:56:31 EST Received: by gould (5.52/(IC 19May87-13:37)) id AA04443; Fri, 2 Nov 90 12:57:07 EST Received: from PO10.ANDREW.CMU.EDU by encore.encore.com with SMTP (5.64/25-eef) id AA15625; Fri, 2 Nov 90 12:57:46 -0500 Received: by po10.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for dlaw@encore.com; Fri, 2 Nov 90 12:53:03 EST Received: via switchmail for sgroup+@andrew.cmu.edu; Fri, 2 Nov 90 12:52:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 2 Nov 90 12:49:29 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Received: from att.att.com by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for Sgroup+; Fri, 2 N